Something Wrong With My Beardie

[PrincePhilip]

Enclosure info:
38C in basking area, 27C ambient
Reptisun 10.0 for UVB, however it’s been a little bit over a year since I’ve gotten him a replacement bulb, tried to get something this past week but since no stores around me supply them I have to order them in, gotta wait another week for one now cuz this last one came in busted, using a temporary “All Living Things” neodymium basking bulb right now. Has heat and UVB in it.
Paper towels for substrate.
Fed superworms (dusted), grub pie and squash, he refuses greens, I’ve tried pretty much everything.
I haven’t kept up on bathing him as much as I should but I do give him water with a syringe regularly, baths occasionally still.
No way to check humidity yet but I would say 60-65 at the most.

I think that’s all... now onto symptoms:
Symptoms started about a month ago (August 9th), he would seem uncomfortable in his sleep, doing motions as if he was trying to push something out.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/324357470350999562/485449869478068225/video.mov (Not sure if these are gunna work but worth a try.)
He did it for 2 nights in a row but seemed absolutely fine during the day and afterwards, no motions or anything of the sort. He also tends to do weird stuff when he’s shedding (which he was and still is) so didn’t think anything of it really.
It was fine until 2 weeks ago (August 21st), he pooped right before having some sort of freakout, like something was still stuck and he couldn’t get it out. His eyes would sink in and close, open mouth breathing, slight thrashing, lot of twitching in lower belly, and he turned very pale. At this point I brought him to the vet, he felt his belly to see if there was any blockage, nothing. Felt his joints for MDB, nothing. Looked in his mouth, nothing. Spoke to me about potential xrays and blood tests and the costs and sent me home with “Keep an eye on him, if he does it again bring him back, this might just be a one time thing.” So I did.
I also sent a fecal sample in just in case, came back negative. His poops look normal, solid (but mushy) with a white solid urate. He almost strains to push it out though.
Skip to yesterday (August 31st) he poops again, is ok for a small bit but has some twitching in his lower belly again (he has had twitches in other places but he’s been doing them for so long the vet just said they’re normal... yes I go to an “exotics” vet but he’s definitely not the best). Shortly after he has another fit, worse this time, that looked like this.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/324357470350999562/485193941436727316/video.mov (1/2)
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/324357470350999562/485193983476367361/video.mov (2/2)
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/324357470350999562/485194051935797259/video.mov (1/2)
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/324357470350999562/485194168386453525/video.mov (2/2)
And then turned really pale again right after, all this lasted about 10 minutes.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/324357470350999562/485454065623498774/image0.jpg (Darker is normal colors for him, his head turned almost white.)
I bring him to the vet again, this time a different one since the other one wasn’t in, but she supposedly knew beardies so I took the chance. She felt his belly, looked in his mouth, felt his joints, nothing. Sent me home with Baytril and told me to give 0.1 ml of it to him once a day for 2 weeks, she said to eliminate any bacterial cause but... what I’m worried about is will giving him this hurt him more in other ways and just add to the problems?
Then she recommends getting blood tests and xrays done (which is estimated to be about $450 total... bluh) this upcoming tuesday. Told me in the mean time to up his calcium intake, would this be accurate?
Today he is very tired and barely slept through the night with all the pushing and twitching movements in his belly. Very tense in his belly as well, and pale skin. He seems to find comfort on me but he can’t stay on me all the time.
I guess what I’m asking is, should I go through with all this tests, put him through the stress, wait until test results are back, etc. or does it sound too late and should I just let him go before he suffers anymore? I hate to give up and I want to fight for him so badly but in the reality of it all, is it too late to try to fix things and possibly just cause him more grief in the process that may just end up killing him anyways??

Thanks for reading, sorry for how long winded this is but wanted to include as many details as possible.

 

[AHBD]

Wow, I'm so sorry this is happening to your baby. Are you positive it's a male ? Just wanted to rule out an eggbound female. Giving antibiotics " just in case " is not good practice , esp. if it causes further distress. It's terrible that the xrays + bloodwork are so expensive but that may give you the answers you want. Is there another vet in town that can do it for a better price ? That's awfully high.


If you do get xrays + bloodwork, post them here , some of us members + especially Drache613 can read all blood tests very well.

Best wishes, my heart goes out to. I hope it's just a passing thing but it does seem potentially serious.

 

[PrincePhilip]

Wow, I'm so sorry this is happening to your baby. Are you positive it's a male ? Just wanted to rule out an eggbound female. Giving antibiotics " just in case " is not good practice , esp. if it causes further distress. It's terrible that the xrays + bloodwork are so expensive but that may give you the answers you want. Is there another vet in town that can do it for a better price ? That's awfully high.


If you do get xrays + bloodwork, post them here , some of us members + especially Drache613 can read all blood tests very well.

Best wishes, my heart goes out to. I hope it's just a passing thing but it does seem potentially serious.

Thank you for your reply and well wishes.
Not positive on male, no. Looks female but also male but I think the “male” looking bits may just be fat. Again, not really sure. Vet’s not sure either.
That’s what I was thinking as well... and seeing as he’s not eating today (even refused his favorite foods) I don’t think it’d be good to give the antibiotics to him just like that either.
The blood need to be sent away to Ontario (I’m in Canada) for testing, so that’s probably why they’re so expensive. To my knowledge there’s no other vet around here that does it right here (other than maybe the zoo? but I’m not sure they just accept animals outside of their own). I will look and ask around just in case though.
And sadly, since it’s the long weekend, we won’t be able to get him back to the vet til Tuesday. :’(
Just crossing my fingers he can last til then...

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

Oh geez, how horrible! The beard is out too so he/she is definitely distressed.
I am thinking your dragon is female, possibly & having trouble with egg laying perhaps.
I think a blood test would probably be most helpful, but, if you can do both the blood
work & x-rays try to. I know it is pricey! That seems a bit high, I agree but since they
have to send them off I guess that is understandable.
Try to keep him as comfortable overnight to keep his stress low. I hope he doesn't crash
on you over the weekend.
Please keep us posted on how things are going.
Were you able to source a new Reptisun 10 tube bulb for him also? He may not have
been able to absorb calcium very well without strong enough UVB.


Tracie

 

[PrincePhilip]

Hello,

Oh geez, how horrible! The beard is out too so he/she is definitely distressed.
I am thinking your dragon is female, possibly & having trouble with egg laying perhaps.
I think a blood test would probably be most helpful, but, if you can do both the blood
work & x-rays try to. I know it is pricey! That seems a bit high, I agree but since they
have to send them off I guess that is understandable.
Try to keep him as comfortable overnight to keep his stress low. I hope he doesn't crash
on you over the weekend.
Please keep us posted on how things are going.
Were you able to source a new Reptisun 10 tube bulb for him also? He may not have
been able to absorb calcium very well without strong enough UVB.


Tracie

We went to an emergency clinic last night (3 hour drive there... was the closest one) cuz we really wanted to get the xrays done at least, there was nothing alarming in the one that they took, no masses or anything egg looking, nothing abnormal but yeah she said there’s definitely something going on. She also highly recommended the Baytril, again, just to rule it out... I’m still a bit skeptical. Gave me some pain killers and anti-inflammatory, since he was pretty bloated, almost swelled, just in case it gets bad for him again.
Buprenorphine Hcl for the pain killer, Meloxicam Rheumocan for the anti-inflammatory... looking at side effects I’m definitely not going to give him it unless I absolutely have to, possibly in a smaller dose than they gave me.
Now we just gotta hope and wait out until Tuesday to get blood tests done, if we send a rush with it the earliest we’ll get results is Thursday. Just gotta hope they get it done before next weekend cuz then we won’t get results til next Monday.
And no sadly, earliest we could get a new reptisun would be Thursday as well.

 

[AHBD]

I hope your baby gets through this !

 

[PrincePhilip]

I hope your baby gets through this !

Thank you so much... I hope so too.

 

[PrincePhilip]

Hello,

Oh geez, how horrible! The beard is out too so he/she is definitely distressed.
I am thinking your dragon is female, possibly & having trouble with egg laying perhaps.
I think a blood test would probably be most helpful, but, if you can do both the blood
work & x-rays try to. I know it is pricey! That seems a bit high, I agree but since they
have to send them off I guess that is understandable.
Try to keep him as comfortable overnight to keep his stress low. I hope he doesn't crash
on you over the weekend.
Please keep us posted on how things are going.
Were you able to source a new Reptisun 10 tube bulb for him also? He may not have
been able to absorb calcium very well without strong enough UVB.


Tracie

Do you think I should be giving the Baytril? I really don’t want to but if there’s a chance bacteria may be the cause. I’m just scared it’s going to lower his immune system and possibly make things worse.
Also going to mention his mouth is also a lot paler than usual, which scares me as well since it’s almost the same color as my leopard gecko’s mouth just before she passed.

 

[adapa]

I am a brand new beardie ownwe so take my suggestion with a gain of salt.
By my account 3 vets have suggested a course of antibiotics, perhaps it’s time to give that a try?

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

That is a hard call, really. I normally don't condone giving antibiotics without justification.
It is usually best to wait on the blood test results to see if there is infection there. Sometimes
the meds do more harm than good.
You said the gums were pale? She sounds anemic to me. Try giving some greens slurry to
help with iron levels. Or if you have any liquid iron supplement of some type, add a drop
or so in with a slurry.
So no eggs were seen at all on the x-ray, or other masses?
Is her beard dark in color, how is she today?

Keep us posted on her.

Tracie

 

[PrincePhilip]

Hello,

That is a hard call, really. I normally don't condone giving antibiotics without justification.
It is usually best to wait on the blood test results to see if there is infection there. Sometimes
the meds do more harm than good.
You said the gums were pale? She sounds anemic to me. Try giving some greens slurry to
help with iron levels. Or if you have any liquid iron supplement of some type, add a drop
or so in with a slurry.
So no eggs were seen at all on the x-ray, or other masses?
Is her beard dark in color, how is she today?

Keep us posted on her.

Tracie

Yeah I’m too paranoid to give them... may just kill his appetite again too, and that seems to be just returning... though not gunna give him much seeing how much it hurts him to poop.
Gums and tongue are very pale, yes. How would I go about making the slurry? Iron can bind calcium can’t it? I’m not questioning your judgement, just want to understand.
Was pretty okay today, best he’s been so far. Seems to get the twitches and push motions more at night when he’s trying to sleep. Had 2 pieces of squash this morning, dusted, had some water through a syringe too.
We’re not sure we can get the blood tests done this week now... gunna try to get the money but we’re short quite a bit. Pretty late in the week to be doing them now anyways, considering they still need to ship Plus get tested. Just not looking good in terms of that. (EDIT: We’re going to try to get him in Thursday morning. Still may not get anything in until Monday but least it’ll be done.)
No eggs or masses that we could see... going to try to get the picture of the x-ray to show it on here just to double check, since the vet wasn’t exactly a specialized one.
(EDIT: Here’s the xray https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/324357470350999562/486916171657117696/image0.png )
No dark beard, was pretty puffed out and tail was black after he had a very small bowel movement that he seemingly strained way too hard for last night but no black beard.
Going to try to get him some multivitamins too, is Rep-Cal Herptivite (with beta carotene) to be trusted?
EDIT (Wednesday night): He’s not looking good tonight. Bloated, very pale, sunken in eyes (not dehydration), barely lifting his head, weird uncomfortable movements, breathing weird, has resistance and wakes up a little when I move him but otherwise not very responsive.
EDIT (Thursday morning): Vet visit, took the blood tests, just gotta wait and hold out til the results come in. Vet says he’s pretty critical right now, gave me some Critical Care (oxbow) to mix with water and syringe feed him since he’s no longer interested in eating on his own. She said the blood was pretty thin when she drew it so he could very well be anemic. She said I really should give the antibiotics just in case he has sepsis or anemia (she mentioned anemia could be caused by bacteria in the blood stream too). So I just gave him some, didn’t like it very much understandably but he did very well, gave him a little grub pie right after to get the taste out of his mouth. She also really recommended the Meloxicam to be given if anything. Since the Buprenorphine can slow his metabolism and she said that wouldn’t be a good thing since he’s already having troubles with bowel movements.

 

[Esther19]

I am sorry that you and your dragon are having to deal with this.

Forum members: In my opinion, it looks like he is having trouble standing up to move, thus he pushes.
Would that be possible? But, the x-rays were fine. Any thoughts?