I'm the poster in question, here is the link the the full thread.
http://www.reddit.com/r/BeardedDragons/comments/1igqky/on_the_subject_of_feeders/
Please note that I've asked for polite and thoughtful responses and advised a balanced and varied diet in response to the rudeness of others in other threads regarding the feeders in question. I don't care what you feed or don't feed, but if people feel like it is a license to take shots at others without supporting their argument I feel like it should be investigated.
I know it's been done before here on bd.org. One of the posters advised me to visit the site, where I'd see multiple mealworm impactions a month and a fully sourced conversation on mealworms. As far as the long conversation I managed to find I found bickering, immaturity and a complete lack of original sources. The OP was even put down for wanting data. In another thread the OP was mocked and made fun of for wanting data. As far as what I've found of impactions in the past month I've seen sand, freeze dried crickets, freeze dried medley, dehydration in a mealworm free dragon. I also saw an undigested wad of cricket and super exos, which were shrugged off as a
hydration issue by the responder. What if they'd said it was cricket and mealworms?
If there is a meaningful discussion with real data please link me to it, at this point I'm having no luck with the search engine.
As far as the article, whoo boy. It's cited, but not within the text, so each claim I was forced to try and figure out if they found it in their sources or not. One link is dead, two are iguana specific, one is for savannah monitors. I understand the difficulty of finding good sources on the subject since I myself have been looking, but I have trouble with the sources from the start.
The article appears to assume the diet is mice as a staple. In my post I recommend a balanced diet and specifically say they should not be a staple. I can't say I've ever seen anyone recommending pinkies as a staple in this decade.
"However, in the wild dragons eat a wealth of plant matter, so that it makes up 60-90% of their overall diet." Which source did they get this from? I couldn't find it, please enlighten me if you could. We aim for those numbers in our own adult dragons, but that doesn't mean a wild dragon will.
"Considering this, and looking at a dragon’s digestive system, one can safely assume that the inland bearded dragon’s digestive tract has evolved to be most similar to an obligate herbivore’s than to a carnivore’s." They have a short digestive tract, usually seen in predators. While that doesn't mean it *is* a predator (ex. pandas) there isn't much conclusion to be made by simply looking at the digestive tract.
"The fact, however, that they eat primarily insects means that they have clear restrictions on just how much fat from protein they can process on a regular basis, as their body simply has not evolved to be used to such high loads, unlike a carnivore who has a body and metabolism specially adapted for processing high fat protein sources, such as rodents, rabbits, and other small mammals." Or insects are more numerous and readily available, leading to a higher likelihood it will they will make up the larger portion of protein sources. I doubt dragons would deliberately pass up any protein source based on any perceived restrictions.
"Young rodents, such as pinkies and fuzzies, are easy to digest due to their soft bones, thereby decreasing the risks of impaction from consuming such a large prey item." As pinkies in particular are in question, the article chosen seems to feel they're easily digested.
"Too much fat is often the cause of problems such as fatty liver disease, which can lead to fatal health problems." Raw pinkies have the lowest fat content of any life stage of mice, and at their worst it's comparable to supers. Supers are fed regularly, pinkies are recommend rarely. If dragons are suffering liver problems due to the fat in their diet the entire diet should be suspect, not just one small element of it.
"The fur of fuzzies have sometimes caused mild, to severe, impaction in herps, though this can largely be avoided by cutting a fuzzy in half and feeding each half as a separate portion." Pinkies, the feeder in question, have no fur. Even so, how would cutting a fuzzy in half reduce the risk of fur impaction?
"It is unclear as to how much mammalian protein is safe to feed." They couldn't find the info, but Brandon said bds cannot digest mammalian protein. Where'd you find yours?
If I'd tried to give this to my professors in the day I would've been asked to rewrite it or given an ugly score depending on how nice the prof was feeling that day. As it stands the article makes up info at worst and assumes too much info at best. It is obvious the author came in heavily biased, and there is a reason you don't want research paid for by the company. As it stands I am not convinced.
Seeing as I'm still standing here please try again. Unfortunately from what I've seen of other related discussions in this forum it's moot. I'm not here to fight, I just want to see some effort. I do appreciate the article your did provide, it was more effort than I've seen so far!
What's your take on supers? They do have less phosphorous, but they are higher in fat than a mealworm and still acceptable in many communities that reject mealworms. If you are gonna say "less chitin" please provide a source.
