aparadoxinflux
New member
Hi all, I think this is my first post here, though I've lurked a whole lot. I'm hoping to get some advice because I really feel at a loss and frustrated with my vet right now.
I have an 11-month old beardie named Zuko that I brought home in March-- when I brought him home he came with a clear fecal from the breeder. I brought him to my vet for an establishing visit back in the beginning of August to just get him examined and get a fecal, especially since he was having some runny/not super formed poops.
The vet said she didn't see anything out of the ordinary in the exam, but when the fecal came back it came back positive for pinworms and coccidia. She said she didn't want to treat the pinworms but did want to treat for the coccidia, so we started on a treatment of ponazuril (two doses over 48 hours). I went through the super duper cleaning with a steam cleaner and ammonia-based cleaner, had him in a quarantine set-up with paper towel substrate (he's usually on tile) and just a basic hide and a basking spot made out of plastic bowls from the dollar store so they'd be easy to clean.
Since that first vet visit and stripping his enclosure, he hasn’t been himself. He stopped eating much at all (no interest in roaches, maybe he'll eat a few super worms and if I'm lucky a bite of his greens), where before he was scarfing down 20 roaches in a feeding. And I'm not even sure if this is just him being suddenly not interested in roaches, because he was and is still eating silkworms and hornworm treats fine, and will eat some superworms as well (never been a BSFL fan though).
He's been constantly hiding in the corner in the shade under his hammock under the basking spot, and I have to pick him up and put him under it because he won't voluntarily bask. He's also been digging/scratching at the corner of his cage (the vet examined him and thought he may be female but honestly its been inconclusive--we can't tell whether we see hemipenes or not and he's got relatively small but still definitely visible femoral pores, but regardless, she didn't feel any eggs to indicate being gravid).
After two weeks we did a follow up fecal and he came back clear of the coccidia, but still with what she said was a somewhat high level of pinworms (didn't give me a number because they did it in house and just told me it was a significant amount??). My vet really strongly suggested not treating the pinworms because she said the treatment can have bad side effects, but I'm concerned because obviously, there are still symptoms happening. She said they almost never treat for pinworms unless there's an overbearing load and they're sure its presenting illness.
I was hoping that his lethargy was mostly from stress of having his cage upended, but it's been back together for nearly a month now, all his enrichment back in, and he's still acting the same. When I take him out of his enclosure after he's warmed up he acts fine, when he's in the enclosure he just goes right back to that shady corner.
Despite not really eating much at all though, he's not losing weight and is in fact still gaining weight, and occasionally pooping, if at a much less frequent rate than before.
So something like this makes me think, "okay maybe he's just going through brumation?" but the vet has been really adamant that unless I'm actually changing temps and lights in the tank, he wouldn't be brumating -- but I've seen enough of you all having this same issue that this makes me sort of not trust what she's saying. And she's an ARAV certified vet so I'm so confused.
For husbandry details -- he's in a 36x24x18 melamine enclosure right now, ambient temps (measured with a digital thermometer) on the cool side are 82 right now, 95 on the hot side, and basking usually is between 100-110 measured with a temp gun. UVB is a reptisun T5 10.0, 24" so about 2/3 of tank (and only about 5 months old--new one is in the mail), and overlaps with the basking bulb. Humidity is usually between 40%-50% (that's another thing--everywhere i've read has suggested under 40% humidity but the vet said 40%-60%?), and substrate is tile. I want to change him to soil and play sand at some point but gotta clear all this, first.
I’m just not sure why he’s still been just hiding and laying down and not moving much, eyes at half-mast like he’s getting ready to sleep, for pretty much a full month now. And if it is the pinworms, wouldn't he be losing weight?
We also just did bloodwork to rule anything else out (so that's another $200 I've spent this month), and I just got the call back today and she didn't see anything diagnostic-- the only thing she saw was that his acidophil cells were a little elevated. The next thing she's suggesting is an x-ray, and if that doesn't come up with anything, we can move to ultrasound. I'm hesitant to keep going through all this testing if in fact nothing is actually going on and it's brumation and he's healthy, or in fact this is actually all pinworms related and we should just dang treat.
Could this all be pinworms, and should I really advocate more for treating them? I talked more with her and she said they really don't ever treat them unless super serious, and if we were going to actually do so she'd want to do another fecal and send the sample off for more vigorous testing to get an actual count, and get a second opinion, etc, because she kept saying the side effects of the medication could be liver damage, bone marrow damage, and death.
What the hell is going on, and do I need to seek out another vet? could be going on? Am I just going through a bunch of needless stuff and he's just brumating a little young?
I’m just concerned he’s not getting enough UVB or heat, and if he's not eating much, I'm concerned I'm not getting enough supplementation into him and all this could develop MBD.
Photo of him in the spot he’s been hanging out in, below his hammock, for tax and so this doesn't get buried.
I have an 11-month old beardie named Zuko that I brought home in March-- when I brought him home he came with a clear fecal from the breeder. I brought him to my vet for an establishing visit back in the beginning of August to just get him examined and get a fecal, especially since he was having some runny/not super formed poops.
The vet said she didn't see anything out of the ordinary in the exam, but when the fecal came back it came back positive for pinworms and coccidia. She said she didn't want to treat the pinworms but did want to treat for the coccidia, so we started on a treatment of ponazuril (two doses over 48 hours). I went through the super duper cleaning with a steam cleaner and ammonia-based cleaner, had him in a quarantine set-up with paper towel substrate (he's usually on tile) and just a basic hide and a basking spot made out of plastic bowls from the dollar store so they'd be easy to clean.
Since that first vet visit and stripping his enclosure, he hasn’t been himself. He stopped eating much at all (no interest in roaches, maybe he'll eat a few super worms and if I'm lucky a bite of his greens), where before he was scarfing down 20 roaches in a feeding. And I'm not even sure if this is just him being suddenly not interested in roaches, because he was and is still eating silkworms and hornworm treats fine, and will eat some superworms as well (never been a BSFL fan though).
He's been constantly hiding in the corner in the shade under his hammock under the basking spot, and I have to pick him up and put him under it because he won't voluntarily bask. He's also been digging/scratching at the corner of his cage (the vet examined him and thought he may be female but honestly its been inconclusive--we can't tell whether we see hemipenes or not and he's got relatively small but still definitely visible femoral pores, but regardless, she didn't feel any eggs to indicate being gravid).
After two weeks we did a follow up fecal and he came back clear of the coccidia, but still with what she said was a somewhat high level of pinworms (didn't give me a number because they did it in house and just told me it was a significant amount??). My vet really strongly suggested not treating the pinworms because she said the treatment can have bad side effects, but I'm concerned because obviously, there are still symptoms happening. She said they almost never treat for pinworms unless there's an overbearing load and they're sure its presenting illness.
I was hoping that his lethargy was mostly from stress of having his cage upended, but it's been back together for nearly a month now, all his enrichment back in, and he's still acting the same. When I take him out of his enclosure after he's warmed up he acts fine, when he's in the enclosure he just goes right back to that shady corner.
Despite not really eating much at all though, he's not losing weight and is in fact still gaining weight, and occasionally pooping, if at a much less frequent rate than before.
So something like this makes me think, "okay maybe he's just going through brumation?" but the vet has been really adamant that unless I'm actually changing temps and lights in the tank, he wouldn't be brumating -- but I've seen enough of you all having this same issue that this makes me sort of not trust what she's saying. And she's an ARAV certified vet so I'm so confused.
For husbandry details -- he's in a 36x24x18 melamine enclosure right now, ambient temps (measured with a digital thermometer) on the cool side are 82 right now, 95 on the hot side, and basking usually is between 100-110 measured with a temp gun. UVB is a reptisun T5 10.0, 24" so about 2/3 of tank (and only about 5 months old--new one is in the mail), and overlaps with the basking bulb. Humidity is usually between 40%-50% (that's another thing--everywhere i've read has suggested under 40% humidity but the vet said 40%-60%?), and substrate is tile. I want to change him to soil and play sand at some point but gotta clear all this, first.
I’m just not sure why he’s still been just hiding and laying down and not moving much, eyes at half-mast like he’s getting ready to sleep, for pretty much a full month now. And if it is the pinworms, wouldn't he be losing weight?
We also just did bloodwork to rule anything else out (so that's another $200 I've spent this month), and I just got the call back today and she didn't see anything diagnostic-- the only thing she saw was that his acidophil cells were a little elevated. The next thing she's suggesting is an x-ray, and if that doesn't come up with anything, we can move to ultrasound. I'm hesitant to keep going through all this testing if in fact nothing is actually going on and it's brumation and he's healthy, or in fact this is actually all pinworms related and we should just dang treat.
Could this all be pinworms, and should I really advocate more for treating them? I talked more with her and she said they really don't ever treat them unless super serious, and if we were going to actually do so she'd want to do another fecal and send the sample off for more vigorous testing to get an actual count, and get a second opinion, etc, because she kept saying the side effects of the medication could be liver damage, bone marrow damage, and death.
What the hell is going on, and do I need to seek out another vet? could be going on? Am I just going through a bunch of needless stuff and he's just brumating a little young?
I’m just concerned he’s not getting enough UVB or heat, and if he's not eating much, I'm concerned I'm not getting enough supplementation into him and all this could develop MBD.
Photo of him in the spot he’s been hanging out in, below his hammock, for tax and so this doesn't get buried.
I’m frustrated and not sure what to do when the vet doesn’t even seem to know what she’s talking about. She literally told me to put crushed walnut substrate in his tank after telling me he was possibly impacted. I don’t know what to do anymore and so worried he won’t use his back legs again 
