Beardie not moving well

[laurencamp]

Hi all- i am desperately in search of some answers for my sweet beardie, Brea. She's not very old, around 3 months we think, and we've had her since August. We have a vet appointment tomorrow morning, but in the meantime I'm hoping others in the community may have experienced something similar and can offer thoughts/advice.

the backstory: last friday, my daughter noticed that her back leg wasn't moving well, and she didn't want to eat at all that day. we were able to get her into the vet saturday morning- he took an x-ray of just the leg, and said it wasn't broken and that she still had feeling in it. Vet said that she maybe got it caught in something, freaked out, and tried to run thereby spraining it. we've had her on an anti-inflammatory/pain med that the vet described since then and she was doing much better and was back to eating regularly.

but then this morning, both of her arms were strangely floppy and she's not moving well- almost dragging herself around. the back legs now seem fine, but this makes me wonder if there was ever a sprain at all. Could this be MBD? i believe that our basking temps and calcium supplementation are all good, although i'm definitely open to feedback on that. it just all happened so suddenly that i'm at a total loss.

 

[KarrieRee]

Hi all- i am desperately in search of some answers for my sweet beardie, Brea. She's not very old, around 3 months we think, and we've had her since August. We have a vet appointment tomorrow morning, but in the meantime I'm hoping others in the community may have experienced something similar and can offer thoughts/advice.

the backstory: last friday, my daughter noticed that her back leg wasn't moving well, and she didn't want to eat at all that day. we were able to get her into the vet saturday morning- he took an x-ray of just the leg, and said it wasn't broken and that she still had feeling in it. Vet said that she maybe got it caught in something, freaked out, and tried to run thereby spraining it. we've had her on an anti-inflammatory/pain med that the vet described since then and she was doing much better and was back to eating regularly.

but then this morning, both of her arms were strangely floppy and she's not moving well- almost dragging herself around. the back legs now seem fine, but this makes me wonder if there was ever a sprain at all. Could this be MBD? i believe that our basking temps and calcium supplementation are all good, although i'm definitely open to feedback on that. it just all happened so suddenly that i'm at a total loss.

Please tell me what kind of UVB your using- a coil or a long tube fixture? If its a coil shut it off and get her outside for now in some direct sunlight for some good UVB - 15-30 minutes place her in a plastic tote NO glass supervise her do not leave her ---- you need to get a long tube fixture for a UVB I can help -- what size is the tank? Surface basking temps what are they and how are you taking them? NO stickons please they are inaccurate- you want a digital probe thermometer for the most accurate temps 105-110

 

[laurencamp]

Hi Karrie- thank you for getting back to me so quickly! We use a Zoo Med ReptiSun 10.0 T5 HO, inside her enclosure, about 13 inches above the basking spot. She's in a Zen Habitats 4 x 2 x 2 enclosure. i use a 100W halogen for the basking spot and I also have a CHE bulb in there; because of where the tank is located relative to our AC vent, i wasn't able to get it warm enough otherwise. i primarily measure temps with an infrared temp gun. i do also have a digital probe thermometer/hygrometer, but i'm not as clear on how to effectively use that. i've included a pic of her setup below. Any advice you can offer would be so appreciated- we're extremely worried!

 

[KarrieRee]

Hi Karrie- thank you for getting back to me so quickly! We use a Zoo Med ReptiSun 10.0 T5 HO, inside her enclosure, about 13 inches above the basking spot. She's in a Zen Habitats 4 x 2 x 2 enclosure. i use a 100W halogen for the basking spot and I also have a CHE bulb in there; because of where the tank is located relative to our AC vent, i wasn't able to get it warm enough otherwise. i primarily measure temps with an infrared temp gun. i do also have a digital probe thermometer/hygrometer, but i'm not as clear on how to effectively use that. i've included a pic of her setup below. Any advice you can offer would be so appreciated- we're extremely worried! View attachment 74187

Ok so the tank is set up good ---- now I am stumped as to what is going on here-- place the digital probe on the spot where she basks - but since shes not moving I would move her into a tote like this -- set it up w/ your basking lamp and UVB --- make sure your using the digital probe thermometer to get basking temps of 105-110--- since shes not moving and having a hard time use some rolled up dish towels make sure your distance is 12 inches above her for the UVB -- it will be easier for her to move and for you to take care of her in this smaller tank --- I am going to flag a few people on here one is our vet tech mod -- did they do blood work at the vets -- if they did you can post it and Tracie can look at it --
@AHBD
@Drache613

 

[laurencamp]

this is so helpful, thank you! i'll get this set up as soon as i get home, how long would you recommend keeping her in there? we feed her dubias primarily and dust them with calcium and repashy supervite 5x per week. she's not super into veggies but will eat dandelion greens sometimes. we also just introduced BSFL, which she's not super into yet but will hopefully adjust to. she drinks well during baths. last time we were at the vet, he said he thought she was a little too small to do bloodwork, but i'll ask again when we see him tomorrow morning. i'm just so worried, she's usually such a sweet and active little girl. it is my impression that MBD, especially to the point of not moving well and dragging limbs, takes awhile to develop, and this was very sudden. we never let her out of her enclosure unsupervised, so if she fell it would have to have been in her tank. have you ever seen anything like this before? also, during the 3 days when she wasn't eating (which started friday) i was giving her fluker's ReptaBoost via syringe.

 

[xp29]

Mbd is a progressive disease i think, it gets worse with time (untreared). You have uvb so its likely not that. Did the vet check her for adv? (Adenovirus). At 3 months old that would make more sense than mbd. Hopefully it isn't that either, it was just a thought.

 

[laurencamp]

Mbd is a progressive disease i think, it gets worse with time (untreared). You have uvb so its likely not that. Did the vet check her for adv? (Adenovirus). At 3 months old that would make more sense than mbd. Hopefully it isn't that either, it was just a thought.

He didn't check her for ADV yet, although he said that based on observation he didn't think that was likely. I'm wondering if it's neurological? or hopefully i'm freaking out for no reason. i know my husband thinks i've gone off the deep end lol. i'm really hoping we can get some bloodwork done- and get some answers- tomorrow. does ADV affect mobility?

 

[KarrieRee]

He didn't check her for ADV yet, although he said that based on observation he didn't think that was likely. I'm wondering if it's neurological? or hopefully i'm freaking out for no reason. i know my husband thinks i've gone off the deep end lol. i'm really hoping we can get some bloodwork done- and get some answers- tomorrow. does ADV affect mobility?

I believe so but I am not sure-- leave her in the tote usually a 20 gallon works good - I need Tracie to respond to this post she can better assist you w/ the medical questions and the adv - I have seen mbd come on sudden like this - are the limbs swollen?

 

[xp29]

Adv can cause neurological problems, which in turn can cause all manners if side effects. Hopefully it's neither.
It is kindda odd that its the front legs though, usually it's the rear legs that seem to have issues.

 

[laurencamp]

I believe so but I am not sure-- leave her in the tote usually a 20 gallon works good - I need Tracie to respond to this post she can better assist you w/ the medical questions and the adv - I have seen mbd come on sudden like this - are the limbs swollen?

I don't think the limbs are swollen, although i'm not sure, i'll attach a photo of her later this evening!

 

[AHBD]

Sorry to hear about little Brea, it's so stressful to see a strange , unexpected health issue like this. It may have to do with MBD, or lack of ability to absorb calcium, might have been injured by a jump from up high or possibly be a genetic problem. ADV can't be ruled out but this isn't a typical symptom. She is too mall for a blood draw but keep her in the smaller " hospital " set up where she can get closer to the unobstructed uvb bulb that will sit across the top as well as a heat lamp. If it's warm outside you can carry her out in the tote for direct sunlight for 30-45 minutes, staying with her of course.

 

[laurencamp]

Sorry to hear about little Brea, it's so stressful to see a strange , unexpected health issue like this. It may have to do with MBD, or lack of ability to absorb calcium, might have been injured by a jump from up high or possibly be a genetic problem. ADV can't be ruled out but this isn't a typical symptom. She is too mall for a blood draw but keep her in the smaller " hospital " set up where she can get closer to the unobstructed uvb bulb that will sit across the top as well as a heat lamp. If it's warm outside you can carry her out in the tote for direct sunlight for 30-45 minutes, staying with her of course.

thank you all for your well wishes! we went to the vet this morning... she's indeed too small for a blood draw— she is 27 grams right now. the doctor thinks that it's most likely ADV, based on what he was seeing. he gave her a tube feeding and fluids, as he thought she was dehydrated as well. He said he thinks that when she sprained her leg last week, it caused the virus to flare up. he thinks the lack of mobility in her arms right now could be due to fatigue and exhaustion. he says he's somewhat hopeful that we can get her strength and nutrition back up and that she can live a normal life. i'm not entirely optimistic, and i hate to see her suffering. we have some OxBow Critical Care and are going to take things one day at a time and can hopefully get her eating better on her own.

 

[AHBD]

O.K., how did she do with the feeding and how is she doing now ? When they're small it's hard to give them a tube feeding but hopefully the vet was super careful. If you want an expert to test for ADV, one of the mods. here , Tracie [ Drache613 ] works with the very lab that studies it and she can get it done very inexpensively. Flag her if you'd like to work with her, she's very experienced on dealing with ADV.

 

[laurencamp]

O.K., how did she do with the feeding and how is she doing now ? When they're small it's hard to give them a tube feeding but hopefully the vet was super careful. If you want an expert to test for ADV, one of the mods. here , Tracie [ Drache613 ] works with the very lab that studies it and she can get it done very inexpensively. Flag her if you'd like to work with her, she's very experienced on dealing with ADV.

I do really like our vet- he specializes in reptiles and has always been great. she did perk up a bit after the feeding, although she was still pretty lethargic when i took her back home. i had to go into the office and when i left she was chilling on her basking log. so we'll see how she's doing when i get home. this morning she didn't come out from her sleeping spot to bask, which is the first time she's ever done that, so I was super worried. I would love to work with Tracie! So are there ways to test for ADV other than through a blood test? Also, my apologies, I'm not sure how to flag within this post!

 

[AHBD]

You send a small fecal sample and they check that.

Drache613

www.beardeddragon.org