Babies SHOULD eat their salads

[Claudiusx]

Sounds like a good routine to me, especially with her eating her salads

However, I typically don't like to go over 5 or 6 supers a day (although I do on occasion.. can't help it sometimes ha). It's great that she is getting 2 different protein sources though. For that reason though I think it would be best to limit her supers to 5 or 6 instead.

-Brandon

 

[ksk810]

Yeah I thought maybe it would be good to start limiting those... :lol: Thank you!

 

[Hatchi]

• Baby dragons should be eating their salads

There is an arbitrary ratio floating around in the beardie world that growing dragons should eat 80% insects and 20% salad. Even if this ratio was based off anything viable, let's be honest, many young dragons are lucky to eat a few leaves a month. That's far from the 80/20 rule anyways.

So many people use the rational that a young dragon really only needs the insects because it's growing so quickly. This can't be further from the truth, and touches on a thought process that I believe to be backwards. So many people are concerned with their dragons growing quick, putting on weight fast, becoming adult size by 6 months, that the term "good health" becomes an afterthought.
We have 1 obligation to these creatures - Give them a good long healthy life. There are many roads to do this, but keeping health in mind over fast growth is a good start.

Why it's important for dragons to eat their salads

I always recommend variety in the diet. Variety with feeder bugs, and variety with salad items. The reason is because there is not 1 single food that provides everything that these creatures need. A varied diet helps mitigate the risk of nutritional deficiencies. Simply put, there just isn't any way to feed a diet of only insects without there being a lack of some micro nutrient.

A dragon that starts off eating salads from an early age, tends to continue to eat salads on a regular basis for it's entire life. A lot of times, when babies aren't fond of salads, they grow into adults who don't want salads either. And because of this, we get a lot of adults that are way over fed on fats and proteins. And this can lead to some serious health complications, sooner or later.

Salads are important too for the growth of a baby dragon. Protein may be the building blocks of muscles and growth, but that protein needs the proper micronutrients available in the body to be shuttled into the cells. Not to mention, there is a lot more that goes into the health of any living creature than just the ability to grow and mature. And lets not forget, that salad items are great for hydration, roughage, and good gastrointestinal health.

So how do I get my baby to eat salad?

This is what is making this a topic for the advanced discussion. I've raised hundreds of dragons at the point, and iv'e raised over a dozen as pets well into adulthood. There is one method I've used on every single one of these dragons, that has made them eat salad from a very early age.

Hatchlings typically are relatively eager to eat salad items. Especially once they start seeing clutchmates chomping. Personally, I haven't had to do much to get hatchlings to eat their salads besides provide it to them.

What happens if you got a dragon past the hatchlings phase, as most of you will. Lets say 1 or 2 months old (or even older). The first thing to do is allow your dragon to settle into it's new home. Allow the relocation stress to subside, and let your dragon eat what it wants. After this period has passed, the method is simple. Either they have already been eating their salads (you should have been offering them a salad every day from day 1) or they haven't. If they haven't ate their salads at all in the few weeks you've had him/her, it's time to stop with the bugs.
Stay with me here, I promise you no ill will come to your growing dragon from missing a few bug meals. You aren't starving him here. He has the option to eat if he wants. And he will eat when he wants. Sometimes it only takes 1 missed feeding. Sometimes it takes a day of missed feedings. I've had a few dragons take 2 or 3 days of missed feeding before eating their salads finally. But they always do. And 99% of the time, once that initial barrier is broken, they will continue to eat their salads.

I've done this with every single dragon I've ever owned, and it's worked on every single one of them. And not one of them has ever been what some might call a "slow grower". In fact, I've compared my dragons growth rates and sizes at certain ages to members here. To other owners who don't care about their dragons eating salad. And guess what? My dragons grow just as quick, and just as big. In some cases, my dragons outgrow the others on here eating only insects. But quick growth isn't my goal. Health is my goal. And a long healthy happy life at that.

Conclusion

Lets be honest here. Even if you believe in the 80/20 rule, you're not following it if your dragon never eats it's salads. The method I laid out above is simply 1 method to fix this. A method I've used over the past ~20 years with success. I'm sure other people have their ways, but too many people don't even have "a way". If you need to stop feeding insects for a day or 2 to get your dragon to start eating salads, then I believe you should.
I truly believe, that a few days without insects is a lot lesser of an evil than a dragon not touching salad the entire time it's body is maturing.

-Brandon

I totally agree. Thanks for letting people know!

 

[shmoomunchkin]

• Baby dragons should be eating their salads

There is an arbitrary ratio floating around in the beardie world that growing dragons should eat 80% insects and 20% salad. Even if this ratio was based off anything viable, let's be honest, many young dragons are lucky to eat a few leaves a month. That's far from the 80/20 rule anyways.

So many people use the rational that a young dragon really only needs the insects because it's growing so quickly. This can't be further from the truth, and touches on a thought process that I believe to be backwards. So many people are concerned with their dragons growing quick, putting on weight fast, becoming adult size by 6 months, that the term "good health" becomes an afterthought.
We have 1 obligation to these creatures - Give them a good long healthy life. There are many roads to do this, but keeping health in mind over fast growth is a good start.

Why it's important for dragons to eat their salads

I always recommend variety in the diet. Variety with feeder bugs, and variety with salad items. The reason is because there is not 1 single food that provides everything that these creatures need. A varied diet helps mitigate the risk of nutritional deficiencies. Simply put, there just isn't any way to feed a diet of only insects without there being a lack of some micro nutrient.

A dragon that starts off eating salads from an early age, tends to continue to eat salads on a regular basis for it's entire life. A lot of times, when babies aren't fond of salads, they grow into adults who don't want salads either. And because of this, we get a lot of adults that are way over fed on fats and proteins. And this can lead to some serious health complications, sooner or later.

Salads are important too for the growth of a baby dragon. Protein may be the building blocks of muscles and growth, but that protein needs the proper micronutrients available in the body to be shuttled into the cells. Not to mention, there is a lot more that goes into the health of any living creature than just the ability to grow and mature. And lets not forget, that salad items are great for hydration, roughage, and good gastrointestinal health.

So how do I get my baby to eat salad?

This is what is making this a topic for the advanced discussion. I've raised hundreds of dragons at the point, and iv'e raised over a dozen as pets well into adulthood. There is one method I've used on every single one of these dragons, that has made them eat salad from a very early age.

Hatchlings typically are relatively eager to eat salad items. Especially once they start seeing clutchmates chomping. Personally, I haven't had to do much to get hatchlings to eat their salads besides provide it to them.

What happens if you got a dragon past the hatchlings phase, as most of you will. Lets say 1 or 2 months old (or even older). The first thing to do is allow your dragon to settle into it's new home. Allow the relocation stress to subside, and let your dragon eat what it wants. After this period has passed, the method is simple. Either they have already been eating their salads (you should have been offering them a salad every day from day 1) or they haven't. If they haven't ate their salads at all in the few weeks you've had him/her, it's time to stop with the bugs.
Stay with me here, I promise you no ill will come to your growing dragon from missing a few bug meals. You aren't starving him here. He has the option to eat if he wants. And he will eat when he wants. Sometimes it only takes 1 missed feeding. Sometimes it takes a day of missed feedings. I've had a few dragons take 2 or 3 days of missed feeding before eating their salads finally. But they always do. And 99% of the time, once that initial barrier is broken, they will continue to eat their salads.

I've done this with every single dragon I've ever owned, and it's worked on every single one of them. And not one of them has ever been what some might call a "slow grower". In fact, I've compared my dragons growth rates and sizes at certain ages to members here. To other owners who don't care about their dragons eating salad. And guess what? My dragons grow just as quick, and just as big. In some cases, my dragons outgrow the others on here eating only insects. But quick growth isn't my goal. Health is my goal. And a long healthy happy life at that.

Conclusion

Lets be honest here. Even if you believe in the 80/20 rule, you're not following it if your dragon never eats it's salads. The method I laid out above is simply 1 method to fix this. A method I've used over the past ~20 years with success. I'm sure other people have their ways, but too many people don't even have "a way". If you need to stop feeding insects for a day or 2 to get your dragon to start eating salads, then I believe you should.
I truly believe, that a few days without insects is a lot lesser of an evil than a dragon not touching salad the entire time it's body is maturing.

-Brandon

This is a GREAT post...hoping it stays visible!

 

[MollyM]

• Baby dragons should be eating their salads

There is an arbitrary ratio floating around in the beardie world that growing dragons should eat 80% insects and 20% salad. Even if this ratio was based off anything viable, let's be honest, many young dragons are lucky to eat a few leaves a month. That's far from the 80/20 rule anyways.

So many people use the rational that a young dragon really only needs the insects because it's growing so quickly. This can't be further from the truth, and touches on a thought process that I believe to be backwards. So many people are concerned with their dragons growing quick, putting on weight fast, becoming adult size by 6 months, that the term "good health" becomes an afterthought.
We have 1 obligation to these creatures - Give them a good long healthy life. There are many roads to do this, but keeping health in mind over fast growth is a good start.

Why it's important for dragons to eat their salads

I always recommend variety in the diet. Variety with feeder bugs, and variety with salad items. The reason is because there is not 1 single food that provides everything that these creatures need. A varied diet helps mitigate the risk of nutritional deficiencies. Simply put, there just isn't any way to feed a diet of only insects without there being a lack of some micro nutrient.

A dragon that starts off eating salads from an early age, tends to continue to eat salads on a regular basis for it's entire life. A lot of times, when babies aren't fond of salads, they grow into adults who don't want salads either. And because of this, we get a lot of adults that are way over fed on fats and proteins. And this can lead to some serious health complications, sooner or later.

Salads are important too for the growth of a baby dragon. Protein may be the building blocks of muscles and growth, but that protein needs the proper micronutrients available in the body to be shuttled into the cells. Not to mention, there is a lot more that goes into the health of any living creature than just the ability to grow and mature. And lets not forget, that salad items are great for hydration, roughage, and good gastrointestinal health.

So how do I get my baby to eat salad?

This is what is making this a topic for the advanced discussion. I've raised hundreds of dragons at the point, and iv'e raised over a dozen as pets well into adulthood. There is one method I've used on every single one of these dragons, that has made them eat salad from a very early age.

Hatchlings typically are relatively eager to eat salad items. Especially once they start seeing clutchmates chomping. Personally, I haven't had to do much to get hatchlings to eat their salads besides provide it to them.

What happens if you got a dragon past the hatchlings phase, as most of you will. Lets say 1 or 2 months old (or even older). The first thing to do is allow your dragon to settle into it's new home. Allow the relocation stress to subside, and let your dragon eat what it wants. After this period has passed, the method is simple. Either they have already been eating their salads (you should have been offering them a salad every day from day 1) or they haven't. If they haven't ate their salads at all in the few weeks you've had him/her, it's time to stop with the bugs.
Stay with me here, I promise you no ill will come to your growing dragon from missing a few bug meals. You aren't starving him here. He has the option to eat if he wants. And he will eat when he wants. Sometimes it only takes 1 missed feeding. Sometimes it takes a day of missed feedings. I've had a few dragons take 2 or 3 days of missed feeding before eating their salads finally. But they always do. And 99% of the time, once that initial barrier is broken, they will continue to eat their salads.

I've done this with every single dragon I've ever owned, and it's worked on every single one of them. And not one of them has ever been what some might call a "slow grower". In fact, I've compared my dragons growth rates and sizes at certain ages to members here. To other owners who don't care about their dragons eating salad. And guess what? My dragons grow just as quick, and just as big. In some cases, my dragons outgrow the others on here eating only insects. But quick growth isn't my goal. Health is my goal. And a long healthy happy life at that.

Conclusion

Lets be honest here. Even if you believe in the 80/20 rule, you're not following it if your dragon never eats it's salads. The method I laid out above is simply 1 method to fix this. A method I've used over the past ~20 years with success. I'm sure other people have their ways, but too many people don't even have "a way". If you need to stop feeding insects for a day or 2 to get your dragon to start eating salads, then I believe you should.
I truly believe, that a few days without insects is a lot lesser of an evil than a dragon not touching salad the entire time it's body is maturing.

-Brandon

Hi Brandon! I’ve read your article, super well done ! The only question I have not bern able to answer by myself is about quantity. My BD is maybe 4 months old, he eats between 5-10 crickets a day depending on size with 3-4 mealworms in his salad. He eats all of his salad throughout the day, but looks famnished and devours those crickets like je has never eaten in his short life lol! Should I be refilling his salad ? He has a constant growth chart in terms of weight and length, but I still wonder if he shouls get more greens.. Ty in advance for any tips !

 

[Claudiusx]

That looks like a good sized salad for his age, but if he's eating it easily, you might want to add a little bit more to it. You will likely have to keep adjusting as he grows. I would just increase the size as opposed to giving him two salads a day, but that is just personal preference.

It's great that he's eating so well at a young age. That's how it should be

-Brandon

 

[MollyM]

That looks like a good sized salad for his age, but if he's eating it easily, you might want to add a little bit more to it. You will likely have to keep adjusting as he grows. I would just increase the size as opposed to giving him two salads a day, but that is just personal preference.

It's great that he's eating so well at a young age. That's how it should be

-Brandon

Ty ! I will adjust over the next few days and see how it goes !

 

[Sue E.]

• Baby dragons should be eating their salads

There is an arbitrary ratio floating around in the beardie world that growing dragons should eat 80% insects and 20% salad. Even if this ratio was based off anything viable, let's be honest, many young dragons are lucky to eat a few leaves a month. That's far from the 80/20 rule anyways.

So many people use the rational that a young dragon really only needs the insects because it's growing so quickly. This can't be further from the truth, and touches on a thought process that I believe to be backwards. So many people are concerned with their dragons growing quick, putting on weight fast, becoming adult size by 6 months, that the term "good health" becomes an afterthought.
We have 1 obligation to these creatures - Give them a good long healthy life. There are many roads to do this, but keeping health in mind over fast growth is a good start.

Why it's important for dragons to eat their salads

I always recommend variety in the diet. Variety with feeder bugs, and variety with salad items. The reason is because there is not 1 single food that provides everything that these creatures need. A varied diet helps mitigate the risk of nutritional deficiencies. Simply put, there just isn't any way to feed a diet of only insects without there being a lack of some micro nutrient.

A dragon that starts off eating salads from an early age, tends to continue to eat salads on a regular basis for it's entire life. A lot of times, when babies aren't fond of salads, they grow into adults who don't want salads either. And because of this, we get a lot of adults that are way over fed on fats and proteins. And this can lead to some serious health complications, sooner or later.

Salads are important too for the growth of a baby dragon. Protein may be the building blocks of muscles and growth, but that protein needs the proper micronutrients available in the body to be shuttled into the cells. Not to mention, there is a lot more that goes into the health of any living creature than just the ability to grow and mature. And lets not forget, that salad items are great for hydration, roughage, and good gastrointestinal health.

So how do I get my baby to eat salad?

This is what is making this a topic for the advanced discussion. I've raised hundreds of dragons at the point, and iv'e raised over a dozen as pets well into adulthood. There is one method I've used on every single one of these dragons, that has made them eat salad from a very early age.

Hatchlings typically are relatively eager to eat salad items. Especially once they start seeing clutchmates chomping. Personally, I haven't had to do much to get hatchlings to eat their salads besides provide it to them.

What happens if you got a dragon past the hatchlings phase, as most of you will. Lets say 1 or 2 months old (or even older). The first thing to do is allow your dragon to settle into it's new home. Allow the relocation stress to subside, and let your dragon eat what it wants. After this period has passed, the method is simple. Either they have already been eating their salads (you should have been offering them a salad every day from day 1) or they haven't. If they haven't ate their salads at all in the few weeks you've had him/her, it's time to stop with the bugs.
Stay with me here, I promise you no ill will come to your growing dragon from missing a few bug meals. You aren't starving him here. He has the option to eat if he wants. And he will eat when he wants. Sometimes it only takes 1 missed feeding. Sometimes it takes a day of missed feedings. I've had a few dragons take 2 or 3 days of missed feeding before eating their salads finally. But they always do. And 99% of the time, once that initial barrier is broken, they will continue to eat their salads.

I've done this with every single dragon I've ever owned, and it's worked on every single one of them. And not one of them has ever been what some might call a "slow grower". In fact, I've compared my dragons growth rates and sizes at certain ages to members here. To other owners who don't care about their dragons eating salad. And guess what? My dragons grow just as quick, and just as big. In some cases, my dragons outgrow the others on here eating only insects. But quick growth isn't my goal. Health is my goal. And a long healthy happy life at that.

Conclusion

Lets be honest here. Even if you believe in the 80/20 rule, you're not following it if your dragon never eats it's salads. The method I laid out above is simply 1 method to fix this. A method I've used over the past ~20 years with success. I'm sure other people have their ways, but too many people don't even have "a way". If you need to stop feeding insects for a day or 2 to get your dragon to start eating salads, then I believe you should.
I truly believe, that a few days without insects is a lot lesser of an evil than a dragon not touching salad the entire time it's body is maturing.

-Brandon

Thank you! This is very helpful advice! My dragon doesnt touch salad! He is a year and 2 months old...today he has a mix of collard greens, one kale leaf, some baby arugula, and some celery leaves in his bowl. He also gets dandelion greens but they were too limp to feed today. I have tried adding basil, cilantro, bell pepper, yellow squash, butternut squash to his greens without success. I even tried a little grated carrot topper, a strawberry chopped into smaller pieces, a blueberry cut in half, although I know fruit isnt good on a regular basis for them. Bee pollen powder is hard to find around here so I havent tried it. He investigates his greens, sees if there are any bugs in there, and then leaves greens scattered around his enclosure. I feed him 6 worms every other day. Today is a bug day but I wont offer them until later so he gets a chance to eat his greens. He wont touch crickets anymore (sick of them) so I am going to get him some calciworms for today. He had 3 superworms day before yesterday but I am scared to give him any more of those because he hasnt pooped since eating them...he last went 3 days ago and it was moist and normal with moist white urate. Here is a pic of him: (I should add he has good fat pads and a pretty thick tail but not a super thick body). Live silkworms are impossible to find during winter and often other bugs as well. I dont really want to order online because the shipping costs are outrageous. It is very cold here..21 degrees today, but his temps and uvb are spot on. We live in upstate ny.

 

[Connie-Riley]

I have a story here too. I've seen no one answered the person before me and I'm afraid it's an old post. Anyways, our Beardie is now around 8 month and does not touch her salads. I wanted to try the method you explain above just feeding salad. I read somewhere it's also possible to cut back on insects and hope they eat more salad.
We feed her daily 30 BSFL for 1 1/2 weeks and then 8 crickets for about a week. Then the 30 BSFL gain and so on. The BSFL I put in the salad and sometimes she catches a leave with it. The crickets I feed separate but she has her greens in the tank of course. We put the greens in in the morning and I feed the insects in the afternoon hoping she has eaten some greens until then. She only gets one feeding a day but the greens are in there the whole day. I sometimes make a fresh one during afternoon.
I started 3 days ago with cutting back on BSFL. First day 25, second day 20, today 15. She does not touch greens yet.
Do you think I should move on like this or no insects at all? She already looks at me like she hates me for what I'm doing to her.
BTW, I tried everything, different greens, bearded dragon crack toppings, spraying the salad and so on

 

[xp29]

Size can very wildly at 8 months old. It depends on how big your girl is. If she is still small and growing she still needs some protein. If she is at or very near adult size, you should be cutting the insects back anyways.
There really isn't much way of making them eat green except to let them get hungry. They can be stubborn enough to make us bonkers

 

[Claudiusx]

Do you think I should move on like this or no insects at all? She already looks at me like she hates me for what I'm doing to her.

You need to cut insects out completely. None at all. Not until she is eating her salads. She's not going to starve to death. She has food readily available to her all day long. It's her choice to not eat. She will once she gets hungry enough.

-Brandon

 

[Connie-Riley]

Thank you Brandon! I was guessing. But, I feel so bad. :-( But you are right

 

[Claudiusx]

It's natural to feel bad, that's why I try to reiterate the fact that you aren't starving them, you're offering them food 24/7. It's just they are choosing not to eat it. They are smart enough to know that if they hold out, they will eventually get bugs. They are also smart enough to know that salad is food, and they won't let themselves starve.

-Brandon

 

[Connie-Riley]

Smart little bastards!

 

[Connie-Riley]

I need to ask again, I’m sorry. She has not eaten now for 3 days. I tried different things: mustard greens, parsley, carrots, kale, quash. Nothing, not even nibbling. I try many times a day to wave in front of her or drop the salad. Nothing. She turns her head away. When does it get critical?