Adenoviruses

[ProxyDragon]

I don't know of a Rep Vet in Montana, if some one knows of one I'd like to know about it. But I'm worried my beardie who just passed, may have had it. Could some one tell me what the symptoms are?

 

[pscaulkins]

I don't know of a Rep Vet in Montana, if some one knows of one I'd like to know about it. But I'm worried my beardie who just passed, may have had it. Could some one tell me what the symptoms are?

My advise is to call all the vets and ask for a referral. Take the one with the most referrals. This is what I did years ago.

Not all beardies with adeno have symptoms. You can have a beardie that appears totally healthy carry the virus. Others are failure to thrive beardies. Most positive dragons don't do well with medications as they lower an already low immune system. One of my positive dragons lowered a 50+ count of coccidia once I fixed an issue with her with no coccidia meds.

 

[shadi11]

I think part of the issue is that no one has really investigated and researched much. Alot of the information is assumptions. Would I rather assume because I had at one point 6 positives in my home that the odds are something could be inside their cages if I get a negative dragon and bring it in, to me I rather have all new set ups. Maybe its paranoia. but honestly do I care my dragons are positive.. Not anymore. I have a 7 year old dragon right now. and a couple who are about 6.. I have had dragons in and out of my house being nursed back to health and sent to their homes again.. We each have been told different things and personally I always went with what Lou Ann said because of all people who has tried to research she has.. And thats where Sandy got most her information as well. There was a point we all contacted almost every person possible. Every once and awhile I will look and see if theres been new studies and honestly there hasnt really been. Miss T if you have read several papers and articles and if theres a potential to reference me to them online I would certainly read them if you could. Because it honestly must not be something I have come across.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

You are welcome. Thanks for the contributions, Sandy & Laura, I appreciate it. I know that I can count on your honesty. After these years, I am STILL trying as I promised that I would.
I will get answers, as long as people are willing to share & help me gather data.
You are right in the fact that there are no new studies that I know of, either. I tried in vain, to get Dr. Jacobson as well as Dr. Wentz to help contribute to gathering data & help me but to no avail. I will somehow get it done, but it is slow.
I have found a wonderful lab in Dallas with a great staff who cares. It is a very affordable PCR test which is non invasive so there is no reason why breeders cannot afford to test their dragons prior to breeding. The problem is that they just don't want to as they fail to see the value in it.
Hopefully, more people will come forward & wont be afraid to begin testing.
Thanks for all who are interested & willing to help.

Tracie

 

[MissT]

Shadi, I would but I got a new computer since my reading and it took me so long digging for them on the last computer. They were not new studies. They were whatever I could find on adeno. Including articles on adeno in red squirrels (yes, I know red squirrels are not beardies but, they are being hit hard by this virus). I had 3 dragons. One passed away in September. I *should* have waited until I found out the adeno results before getting another but, I'm impatient. As yet, I have not had Travis tested. But, he came from a big breeder that believes adenovirus is pretty much everywhere. So chances are he has it too. So right now I have 2 positives and 1 possible positive. I have thrown away vivs in the past. I have one viv that I will reuse but only because I had a positive dragon in there for just 2 weeks and he never went potty in it! I do intend to retest Phoebe and Huff, yearly. I will probably test Travis this year although my husband is adamant that he doesn't want us to find out (silly man). My positive dragons are not healthy dragons though-Phoebe has gout and Huff has MBD. He has random diarrhea flare ups too but, for the most part, he is just fine
I am not so irresposible as to take no precautions though-I was my hands after handling or touching anything in their vivs. I wash the floor of my living area (where they roam) daily. I steam clean vivs weekly and disinfect where they poop whenever they go. I bath them separately. When Travis is out, I put a big blanket down on the floor. I am careful about having them on me.
But, to me, those are all just standard precautions and nothing I wouldn't normally be doing regardless of adeno.
I don't want people being put off Beardie keeping because it all seems so horrible. I know that if I had read this thread when I started finding out about adeno, I would probably be in a nut house by now!

 

[pscaulkins]

This thread is more for potential breeders then hobbyists to keep their breeders negative. Most positives that thrive have what I call "outside the box" husbandry. Meaning we cater to them. Whatever makes them thrive we do. The only thing in common with regular husbandry is UVB, basking, heat temps. Mine get fed what I found to be the best for them. I would not recommend it to another beardie keeper because it may or may not be good for theirs.

No need to be a in the nut house or freaked.

 

[shadi11]

I have probably read most of the same articles you have then. It didnt matter if it was any other animal or person I was reading it.. Although you have to keep in mind theres how many different strains? and each is different. So in that in my opinion you cant be too careful. Fecal to oral transmission can be transferred in many ways. Do you know that every speck was cleaned that nothing is on that dragon for sure.. I have put three cages of my six out of service in the last couple years, because its the safer thing to do and really 4x2 enclosures take up too much room to lay around. To be honest I also dont see the point in testing yearly expecially a dragon that is already positive.. Not trying to sound mean but whats the point? maybe for information gathering purposes, but once positive its positive. And seems like a waist of money to me. Unless you have negative and positives but still unless your breeding? And I have to also agree with Sandy because if I went into details of my care for the last eight years you would probably be in shock. and treatments that we have come up with as well.

 

[MissT]

The retesting is something Tracie has asked me to do and I want to help her with her research.

I do know what you and Sandy mean about coming up with treatments etc -I have come up with all sorts (usually with help from Tracie) during my short but very hectic 4 years of experience! I research everything I can.

Maybe I forget that most people have not been through what I have and normal to me isn't normal to everyone. Everything is separated and labelled in my house. I have a strict routine to minimise risks- I have done since well before the adeno was confirmed but like I said, in my head, that is all just part and parcel of having beardies.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

There have been no long term studies with the Adeno so no one really knows for sure, whether they shed the virus or not. We need answers more than what a couple of vets have provided. It is speculation really.
I appreciate Miss T helping out.
I don't think any testing is a waste of money though. The early testing of the fecal EM was inconsistent & really didn't yield a whole lot of answers at that time.
So, I feel that this testing with the Research Associates is much more effective & accurate.

Tracie

 

[ShannyBeard]

Everything is separated and labelled in my house.

Same here! We label our syringes and our food bowls so we are sure each dragon is only having contact with their own stuff. I don't like being/feeling paranoid, though. That being said, I want to keep things as clean as I can. It wasn't so hard when we had just 2 beardies but now that we have 6...! Yeah...it's a lot to pay attention to.

 

[CaptainVimes]

Based on the information already discussed, as I do not know Dexter's history, and I don't have any other Beardies to possibly contaminate, would you suggest I specifically go to get him tested, or not bother until (or IF) he's ill with something, and just get him tested then?

 

[MissT]

It is a personal choice. If you do decide to test him, contact Tracie (Drache613). She can send you out the swab and all you have to do is run it across a poop. Quick, easy and totally painless Plus no unnecessary trips to the vet and it is a very reasonable cost