bad blood test result

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bad blood test result

Postby exoticliz » Wed Jun 05, 2019 11:15 pm

Hi,

(i found some theme about blood result, but all locked, and no one with silimary result..)

I have a problem with a bearded dragon.
The dragon is lazy and does not eat. Dragon is a 7 month age, male.
Terrarium set: 100cm X 40cm X 40cm. Cold zone 28-30 Celsius at summer time, hot spot 43-45 Celsius. UVB 10 % UVB tube lamp (Change every 4 month).
The dragon is fed twice a day, in the morning he gets some cockroaches and crickets, in the afternoon, eat vegetables, salads. Salad is served to him all day, replaced with fresh every two hours.
With food i use EXOTERRA Calcium with D3 and EXOTERRA MULTIVITAMINS 5 times per week.
In vet clinic we made the blood test, and get that result (see below).
The veterinarian sees it bad but doesn't know how to treat it.
maybe you can help read the results and comment?
Really thank you.

GLU 14.19 mmol/L
CREA <9 μmol/L
UREA 0.7 mmol/L
PHOS 1.86 mmol/L (The vet says normal limits are 0.14-0.3)
CA 2.93 mmol/L (The vet says normal limits are 0.6-0.89)
TP 75 g/L 1(The vet says normal limits are 14-50)
ALB 32 g/L
GLOB 43 g/L
ALB/GLOB 0.7
ALT 104 U/L
ALKP 324 U/L (The vet says normal limits are 129-151)
GGT 0 U/L
TBIL 13 μmmol/L
CHOL 7.55 mmol/L
AMYL 1762 U/L
LIPA 21 U/L
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby kingofnobbys » Thu Jun 06, 2019 1:34 am

Early stage MBD , indicated by P and Ca levels.
PHOS 1.86 mmol/L (The vet says normal limits are 0.14-0.3)
CA 2.93 mmol/L (The vet says normal limits are 0.6-0.89)

2.93/1.86 = 1.57
Reptiles who are healthy have serum Ca/P > 1.5

ALKP 324 U/L (The vet says normal limits are 129-151)

High ALKP levels also indicate an issue related to the bones , in some cases, high ALP levels can indicate heart failure, kidney cancer, other cancer, mononucleosis, or a bacterial infection.


TP 75 g/L 1(The vet says normal limits are 14-50)

indicates dehydration

I'm not a vet, but do have a book on reptile health and can read.
I think you need to be careful with the dragon's diet ( and do something to boost it's blood calcium and hydration ) . More live gut loaded and dusted insects , more leafy high calcium greens and more veg.

Is he showing any physical symptoms ? other than not being interested in food ?

This will help you work out other husbandry issues causing the lack of interest in food : viewtopic.php?f=6&t=236150&p=1815390#p1815390

This will help you get some food into the dragon with assisted feeding :
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=249501
if it wont eat , you have no choice but to force feed it at least 2x per day , I'd do 3x per day as small portions so you don't overload it's kidneys with a sudden boost in protein intake.

You might need to start giving it liquid calcium , this will help boost it's serum calcium levels , this product is excellent and reptiles take it orally very readily because it's sweet tasting.
Calcivet : is a liquid Calcium and Vitamin D3 supplement for addition to water, soft foods or for direct administration in times of emergencies.
Direct oral dose: 0.2mL per 100g body weight.

Please show us the lights and how they are setup. Low levels of UVA can result in a lack of appetite in a reptile.
Low levels of UVB will mean dietary calcium is not metabolized but instead is excreted.
CBDs: Cleopatra & Caesar born 28Jan19.
Puff (RIP 10Dec15),Rex (RIP 16Mar17),Toothless (RIP 26Nov17).Peppa (RIP 22Mar19).
EBTSs : George & Mildred (born july 2010).
EWSs : Fluffy - 4yr rescued lawnmowing accident victim 14Nov17.
Lucky - cat attack rescue, fatal SI RIP 21Jul2010.
Wriggles - rescued injured ,thought she was a big lizard, over 8 yrs old, RIP 2Feb16. .
Gecko : Godzilla the hatchling GEHYRA GECKO (hatched May 2019)
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby kingofnobbys » Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:13 am

further
hot spot 43-45 Celsius.

Nudge that down by 5 degrees C as it's too hot.
refer to : viewtopic.php?f=5&t=233516


UVB 10 % UVB tube lamp (Change every 4 month).

is this a T8 fat tube , or a T5ho thin tube ?
Brand ?
is there a reflector hood ?
is it on top a fine mesh lid ?
how far from his basking spot ?

The dragon is fed twice a day, in the morning he gets some cockroaches and crickets
,
how big (are the crickets ? the roaches ?)
how many do you SEE him eat of each per meal , are you keeping a record of this ?
show us the feeding diary extract for maybe the last month.

Have you tried other insects ?
ie
LARGE BSFL
silkworms (medium size (1" - 1.5" long) , or large)

Salad is served to him all day, replaced with fresh every two hours

Is he grazing on the salad or just leaving it to wilt and dry out ?

I suspect if he looks full, he's filling up on the veg and salad and you need to adjust the salad schedule to get him to eat more insects and adjust the mix of veg & greens you are giving so there are mostly high protein , high calcium.
I'd hold the salad back til later in the day.
CBDs: Cleopatra & Caesar born 28Jan19.
Puff (RIP 10Dec15),Rex (RIP 16Mar17),Toothless (RIP 26Nov17).Peppa (RIP 22Mar19).
EBTSs : George & Mildred (born july 2010).
EWSs : Fluffy - 4yr rescued lawnmowing accident victim 14Nov17.
Lucky - cat attack rescue, fatal SI RIP 21Jul2010.
Wriggles - rescued injured ,thought she was a big lizard, over 8 yrs old, RIP 2Feb16. .
Gecko : Godzilla the hatchling GEHYRA GECKO (hatched May 2019)
kingofnobbys
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby AHBD » Thu Jun 06, 2019 5:25 am

Hi there, can you post pics of your dragon and also of the entire set up, including lights ? Here's how :

https://www.beardeddragon.org/useruploads/ Then use the XIMG to upload them

And one thing I see as a problem right off, multi vitamin 5 days a week is going to be a serious overload. Cut those out totally for at least a few weeks. When you DO start back, just once a week slightly dusted.
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby exoticliz » Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:32 am

thanks all for answers :) now i try to reply to all your comments. (sorry for my poor english).
little bit more info from vet
*Veterinarian made an X-ray photo, nothing found wrong, after x-ray made a blood test about we are talking now;
*Now every day im going to vet clinic with my beardy, veterinarian makes an injection with neurorubine, sodium chloride, glucose. Plus one more injection with vitamin B.

kingofnobbys wrote:Nudge that down by 5 degrees C as it's too hot
- done. Im changed lamp from 50w to 40w. Tomorrow try to bought same style lamp like i used before 50w.
Image

now installed lamp:
Image
Before:
Image
Image

temperature drops to 39-40 Celsius.
Image
i try to put one more thermometer from my aquarium.. and him show the different temp..
Image
tomorrow im go to pet shop and try to bought normal thermometer...
kingofnobbys wrote:is this a T8 fat tube , or a T5ho thin tube ?
Brand ?
is there a reflector hood ?
is it on top a fine mesh lid ?
how far from his basking spot ?

is T8 Tube, 20w, without reflector hood, maximum disctance 25 cm, minimum 13 cm.
Image
Image

kingofnobbys wrote:how big (are the crickets ? the roaches ?)
how many do you SEE him eat of each per meal , are you keeping a record of this ?
show us the feeding diary extract for maybe the last month.
Have you tried other insects ?


Im not keeping a record :) the light turn on at 06:00 and 07:00 im let him eat about 10 min. Always put one insects, when him catch im put one more, if beardy wont run and caching food im take insects back.

beardy insects ration : Blaptica dubia, Nauphoeta cinerea, acheta domesticus, gryllus bimaculatus, gryllus assimilis and zoophobus but the zoophobus is fev time per month. Size of insects i think about 2 cm.

kingofnobbys wrote:Is he grazing on the salad or just leaving it to wilt and dry out ?

I suspect if he looks full, he's filling up on the veg and salad and you need to adjust the salad schedule to get him to eat more insects and adjust the mix of veg & greens you are giving so there are mostly high protein , high calcium.
I'd hold the salad back til later in the day.


salad is changing every 1 h, so they don't wilt and dry out. Beardy sometimes really love and eat salads, but maximum times he leave them to wilt and dry out.. so i always must change it to new.
:(

kingofnobbys wrote:2.93/1.86 = 1.57
Reptiles who are healthy have serum Ca/P > 1.5

do I understand correctly that you are good indicators? my veterinarian says it is too really to high for beardy :(

kingofnobbys wrote:High ALKP levels also indicate an issue related to the bones , in some cases, high ALP levels can indicate heart failure, kidney cancer, other cancer, mononucleosis, or a bacterial infection.

is there at least one way to improve the situation? if I want to use it...

kingofnobbys wrote:indicates dehydration

beardy always get batch one time per meek, for 15 minutes in 30-34 celcius water. from that moment i made bath for my beardy twice per week, or need more?

kingofnobbys wrote:I think you need to be careful with the dragon's diet ( and do something to boost it's blood calcium and hydration ) . More live gut loaded and dusted insects , more leafy high calcium greens and more veg.

My vet says, calciums is to high in blood and I have to reduce its amount to the animal. but i beleave more in you.

kingofnobbys wrote:Is he showing any physical symptoms ? other than not being interested in food ?
nope, only not interested in food.

kingofnobbys wrote:This will help you work out other husbandry issues causing the lack of interest in food : viewtopic.php?f=6&t=236150&p=1815390#p1815390

This will help you get some food into the dragon with assisted feeding :
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=249501
if it wont eat , you have no choice but to force feed it at least 2x per day , I'd do 3x per day as small portions so you don't overload it's kidneys with a sudden boost in protein intake.

You might need to start giving it liquid calcium , this will help boost it's serum calcium levels , this product is excellent and reptiles take it orally very readily because it's sweet tasting.
Calcivet : is a liquid Calcium and Vitamin D3 supplement for addition to water, soft foods or for direct administration in times of emergencies.
Direct oral dose: 0.2mL per 100g body weight.


thanks, now i try to study thanks links which you shared with assisted feeding and other. Really thanks!
Tomorrow go to pet shop and try to bought liquid calcium.

kingofnobbys wrote:Please show us the lights and how they are setup. Low levels of UVA can result in a lack of appetite in a reptile.
Low levels of UVB will mean dietary calcium is not metabolized but instead is excreted.


my lamp parameters - 10% UVB, 33% UVA.
Image

Image

AHBD wrote:And one thing I see as a problem right off, multi vitamin 5 days a week is going to be a serious overload. Cut those out totally for at least a few weeks. When you DO start back, just once a week slightly dusted.

Thanks, Multivitamins from that moment cut totally.

AHBD wrote:Hi there, can you post pics of your dragon and also of the entire set up, including lights ? Here's how :


my beardy pic:
Image
Image
Image
Image

hope I have answered all the questions :)
I hope you understand what I wanted to say. I do not use English often
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby kingofnobbys » Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:53 am

Regarding the t8 tube .

I don't see a reflector (slip on type or reflector hood) so the dragon wont be receiving nearly enough UVA or UVB from it at the distances you mention.

The dragon needs to get within 5cm of the T8 10%UVB naked tube to receive sufficient UVA & UVB.
No reflector ==> 1/2x the level for the same source w/reflector.

I'd upgrade it to a T5HO 12% UVB tube with either a slip on reflector or a reflector hood.
Doing this upgrade will have an immediate effect , see information below :
Image
a very large increase in UVA & UVB , and good levels of UVA & UVB if the dragon can get within 30cm of the tube.

Vitamin B supplementation : did the vet say why he is doing this ?

Ask about giving the dragon a lick of some Vegemite each day from a teaspoon : https://vegemite.com.au/ ,
Image
this will give the dragon a rich source of vitB, sodium, and some extra protein.

I'm sure you can buy a small bottle or a tube of Vegemite online in your country if you can't find it in the supermarket.
the stuff is a great source of vitB and most animals love the taste.

Bedding : what is that gritty stuff you are using for a substrate ?
Image
if it's indigestible it's a danger to her , and if she eats enough of it (accidentially with her food) it's a serious impaction risk.
I'd get rid of it and replace with either absorbant paper toweling (like everyone has in their pantry - comes in roll) and or ceramic floor tiles.

Hydrating in bath :
beardy always get batch one time per meek, for 15 minutes in 30-34 celcius water. from that moment i made bath for my beardy twice per week, or need more?

will only help with a bearded dragon's hydration IF THE DRAG DRINKS the water. They DO NOT absorb moisture via their vent or through their skin , they are arid zone reptiles .
Last edited by kingofnobbys on Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:54 am, edited 4 times in total.
CBDs: Cleopatra & Caesar born 28Jan19.
Puff (RIP 10Dec15),Rex (RIP 16Mar17),Toothless (RIP 26Nov17).Peppa (RIP 22Mar19).
EBTSs : George & Mildred (born july 2010).
EWSs : Fluffy - 4yr rescued lawnmowing accident victim 14Nov17.
Lucky - cat attack rescue, fatal SI RIP 21Jul2010.
Wriggles - rescued injured ,thought she was a big lizard, over 8 yrs old, RIP 2Feb16. .
Gecko : Godzilla the hatchling GEHYRA GECKO (hatched May 2019)
kingofnobbys
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby kingofnobbys » Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:21 am

exoticliz wrote:*Veterinarian made an X-ray photo, nothing found wrong, after x-ray made a blood test about we are talking now;
*Now every day im going to vet clinic with my beardy, veterinarian makes an injection with neurorubine, sodium chloride, glucose. Plus one more injection with vitamin B.


temperature drops to 39-40 Celsius.
Image
i try to put one more thermometer from my aquarium.. and him show the different temp..
Image
The acquarium thermometer will be most accurate of the two.
Get some more (thermometers with probes on long cables) , I recommend 2 or 3 so you can monitor air (zone) temperatures and surface temperatures and see these at a glance.


kingofnobbys wrote:2.93/1.86 = 1.57
Reptiles who are healthy have serum Ca/P > 1.5

do I understand correctly that you are good indicators? my veterinarian says it is too really to high for beardy :(
<<<< maybe someone else will chime in here - like I already stated - i'm not a vet.
kingofnobbys wrote:High ALKP levels also indicate an issue related to the bones , in some cases, high ALP levels can indicate heart failure, kidney cancer, other cancer, mononucleosis, or a bacterial infection.

is there at least one way to improve the situation? if I want to use it...
<<< I think improved diet, with better UV source, the corrected temperatures and calcium will improve this, maybe someone else will chime in here .




My vet says, calciums is to high in blood and I have to reduce its amount to the animal. but i beleave more in you.
<<<< your vet thinks the dragon is suffering hypercalcemia ? This might be the case , need also to get the P down too.

CBDs: Cleopatra & Caesar born 28Jan19.
Puff (RIP 10Dec15),Rex (RIP 16Mar17),Toothless (RIP 26Nov17).Peppa (RIP 22Mar19).
EBTSs : George & Mildred (born july 2010).
EWSs : Fluffy - 4yr rescued lawnmowing accident victim 14Nov17.
Lucky - cat attack rescue, fatal SI RIP 21Jul2010.
Wriggles - rescued injured ,thought she was a big lizard, over 8 yrs old, RIP 2Feb16. .
Gecko : Godzilla the hatchling GEHYRA GECKO (hatched May 2019)
kingofnobbys
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Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 10:56 pm

Re: bad blood test result

Postby Drache613 » Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:00 am

Hello!

I hope you got my email response & will check my email again. So sorry, I am over the road
traveling so sometimes my responses are a bit delayed. I had your thread up last night but
ran out of time.
I agree with the supplementation issues. Overall, I believe there is an overdose syndrome
going on right now so I would recommend cleaning out his system for a few weeks. For now,
I would try to get some greens such as parsely, cilantro, basil, mint & black cherry or tart cherry
juice/extract to mix together. Blend that all together in the blender to make it smooth so you
can give daily to help detox his system. It wouldn't hurt to add some milk thistle liquid or some
powder for him daily, for help with his liver also.
On another note, the AST, ALT ALK values which point to liver enzymes, are elevated. Though
their higher readings don't always indicate kidney or heart failure. It does indicate stress & that
the liver is being taxed to some level. The urea levels look good but the calcium & phosphorus
levels are out of balance simply due to improper UVB & absorption issues.
The Reptiglo 2 tube, is that the current tube UVB bulb you are using now? Are you able to get
either the Arcadia D3 12% tube or the Reptisun 10 tube? As suggested, the tube bulb that you
have now does need a light fixture to help direct the UVB downward. It needs to be mounted
directly overhead so you will need to remove it from the back wall mounting & try to get it right
overhead so he can benefit more from the UVB.
He does need a stronger UVB. One primary situation occurring now is not enough UVB but too
much supplementation. When they aren't exposed to adequate UVB their body cannot properly
absorb calcium or synthesize D3. When too much supplementation is given, it is overloaded in
the system but also throws off the normal levels from stress. The body can't utilize it so it either
stores it improperly or excretes it.

How is he doing today?

Tracie
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby exoticliz » Sat Jun 08, 2019 12:06 pm

Drache613 wrote:I hope you got my email response & will check my email again. So sorry, I am over the road
traveling so sometimes my responses are a bit delayed. I had your thread up last night but
ran out of time.

Hello,
Yes, i got your email :), thanks.
no problem, me to rarely connect to the computer, work a lot at the moment.

Drache613 wrote:I agree with the supplementation issues. Overall, I believe there is an overdose syndrome
going on right now so I would recommend cleaning out his system for a few weeks. For now,
I would try to get some greens such as parsely, cilantro, basil, mint & black cherry or tart cherry
juice/extract to mix together. Blend that all together in the blender to make it smooth so you
can give daily to help detox his system. It wouldn't hurt to add some milk thistle liquid or some
powder for him daily, for help with his liver also.

i bought all of that greens, but don't found clean cherry juice/extract.. tomorrow i try to found that extract "ecologic" or just brand what i can trust, how many need milk thistle? what percentage in that all mixture? im scare to overdose milk. Thanks for that recipe :)
Drache613 wrote:On another note, the AST, ALT ALK values which point to liver enzymes, are elevated. Though
their higher readings don't always indicate kidney or heart failure. It does indicate stress & that
the liver is being taxed to some level. The urea levels look good but the calcium & phosphorus
levels are out of balance simply due to improper UVB & absorption issues.

today i bought reflector for ucb tube bulb and now reflector is installed
Image

Drache613 wrote:The Reptiglo 2 tube, is that the current tube UVB bulb you are using now? Are you able to get
either the Arcadia D3 12% tube or the Reptisun 10 tube? As suggested, the tube bulb that you
have now does need a light fixture to help direct the UVB downward. It needs to be mounted
directly overhead so you will need to remove it from the back wall mounting & try to get it right
overhead so he can benefit more from the UVB.

why you say reptiglo 2? i use reptiglo 10 tube bulb 20w.
Image

i can bought in monday reptisun 10 tube, or order and get in 4-5 work day arcadia d3 12% tube.
http://terariumai.lt/apsvietimo-lempos/ ... ct_id=5168
are this that reptisun? i can bought only 45 cm and only T8, 15w in my city.

or order from other city arcadia, 18w, 60cm.. but that T8:
https://www.repe.lt/arcadia-d3-12-uvb-ropliu-lempa-18w
can i wait 4-5 work days for arcadia? That lamp is better when reptisun? if you said what is better and i cant wait 4-5 days im ordering arcadia.

and i found reptisun 10 t5, but only 30 centimeters long, and if i choose t5 i need wait for 4-5 work days.
https://www.repe.lt/zoo-med-t5-ho-ropli ... 0-30cm-15w

1. what tube bulb is best from that 3 links?
2. how long tube need for 100 cm terrarium?
3. what is minimum and safe distance from uvb bulb to beardy?


my UVB bulb is not on back wall. the tube is directly overhead beardy loving chill place.

HOTSPOT position:
Image

when beardy wont be on hotspot and wont be in cold zone:
Image

Drache613 wrote:He does need a stronger UVB. One primary situation occurring now is not enough UVB but too
much supplementation. When they aren't exposed to adequate UVB their body cannot properly
absorb calcium or synthesize D3. When too much supplementation is given, it is overloaded in
the system but also throws off the normal levels from stress. The body can't utilize it so it either
stores it improperly or excretes it.

i understand, and i ready to bought new uvb and if need i can install few uvb tube bulbs. But please help me made right choice from links i sharred with you. I think i dont know have or no 4-5 work days :( really wait your answer.

Drache613 wrote:How is he doing today?

today he is hyper activ, and want to play. If i show my hand beardy come to me and i really happy.
Before beardy was passive before it, but not interested in food .. i tired with fooding him :(
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby AHBD » Sat Jun 08, 2019 12:10 pm

Hi there, you can get the Arcadia D3 12 %, very good bulb ! And it's good to hear that he is active, he looks very healthy in the pictures. :) If it's sunny where you live you can build an outdoor cage for him too or get a leash for him.
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby exoticliz » Sat Jun 08, 2019 12:58 pm

kingofnobbys wrote:The acquarium thermometer will be most accurate of the two.
Get some more (thermometers with probes on long cables) , I recommend 2 or 3 so you can monitor air (zone) temperatures and surface temperatures and see these at a glance.

hello,
im orderd few thermometers with probes on long cables and without cables.
I think I will get the goods on Monday or Tuesday

kingofnobbys wrote:<<<< maybe someone else will chime in here - like I already stated - i'm not a vet.

i understood :) i want believe what new UVB fix thats calcium issue:(

kingofnobbys wrote:<<< I think improved diet, with better UV source, the corrected temperatures and calcium will improve this, maybe someone else will chime in here .

please look my post about 3 UVB tube bulb links, what i can get in my country and how fast i can do it. please help me make right choice.

kingofnobbys wrote:<<<< your vet thinks the dragon is suffering hypercalcemia ? This might be the case , need also to get the P down too.

my vet thinks the dragon got problem with kidney. but dont have any medicine for reptiles.. in my country popular only cats and dogs....

kingofnobbys wrote:I don't see a reflector (slip on type or reflector hood) so the dragon wont be receiving nearly enough UVA or UVB from it at the distances you mention.

The dragon needs to get within 5cm of the T8 10%UVB naked tube to receive sufficient UVA & UVB.
No reflector ==> 1/2x the level for the same source w/reflector.

I'd upgrade it to a T5HO 12% UVB tube with either a slip on reflector or a reflector hood.
Doing this upgrade will have an immediate effect , see information below :

a very large increase in UVA & UVB , and good levels of UVA & UVB if the dragon can get within 30cm of the tube.

today i installed reflectors. maybe it is wrong reflector.. but only that i was able to get without waiting for delivery.
T5HO i can found only 30 cm long tube, not 60.. and i must to wait 4-5 business day for delivery, can i wait that period? maybe while waiting for normal t5 bulb i can install few t8 tubes?
im really scare what 4-5 days is really long..

kingofnobbys wrote:Vitamin B supplementation : did the vet say why he is doing this ?

vet says that B vitamins and glucose is need for beardy while him not interesting in food.

kingofnobbys wrote:Ask about giving the dragon a lick of some Vegemite each day from a teaspoon : https://vegemite.com.au/ ,

this will give the dragon a rich source of vitB, sodium, and some extra protein.

I'm sure you can buy a small bottle or a tube of Vegemite online in your country if you can't find it in the supermarket.
the stuff is a great source of vitB and most animals love the taste.

yesterday im ordered from ebay few bottles of vegamite. today i printed that product composition and tomorrow go to supermarket and try to find some analogue.
kingofnobbys wrote:Bedding : what is that gritty stuff you are using for a substrate ?

if it's indigestible it's a danger to her , and if she eats enough of it (accidentially with her food) it's a serious impaction risk.
I'd get rid of it and replace with either absorbant paper toweling (like everyone has in their pantry - comes in roll) and or ceramic floor tiles.

Image
Made from 100% pure organic fibre Binds liquid and odour effectively inside the fibre and boasts up to 3 times higher yield than mineral-based cat litters Compostable 100% biodegradable.

that is for cats, and i really read many forums and see a lot of video about it for beardy, it crashes in water and my beardy within 6 months do not eat any pieces of food during a meal and never found any interest in this product. But if i change it and it helps me with beardy - i do it.

kingofnobbys wrote:will only help with a bearded dragon's hydration IF THE DRAG DRINKS the water. They DO NOT absorb moisture via their vent or through their skin , they are arid zone reptiles .

my beardy never drink water.. im many times.. give them container with water but beardy not interested in water. Sometimes i put cricket in water and beardy catch it and get water with cricket :)

i try to assist him drink water
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby exoticliz » Sat Jun 08, 2019 1:04 pm

AHBD wrote:Hi there, you can get the Arcadia D3 12 %, very good bulb ! And it's good to hear that he is active, he looks very healthy in the pictures. :) If it's sunny where you live you can build an outdoor cage for him too or get a leash for him.


Hi,

i can get only T8 Arcadia bulb :(
he looks healty because is loved :) but he is not interested in food.. and you see the blood test result :(
yes, at summer times is sunny, this week outside 30 Celsius, hot and beautiful sun:)
Last edited by exoticliz on Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby AHBD » Sat Jun 08, 2019 1:09 pm

The t8 is O.K as long as you can mount it inside the tank. And the bedding may be a serious impaction risk. If she eats any of it , it will swell up and block her intestines. Best to get rid of it !
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Re: bad blood test result

Postby Drache613 » Sat Jun 08, 2019 9:15 pm

Hello,

So you were able to get a T5 Arcadia ordered? Those are excellent bulbs. You can just
try to get him outside for short time periods under your supervision, while you are waiting for
the new bulbs to come in. As suggested, the T8 bulbs are fine for now, until you can get the
new ones delivered.
I don't think he has too much of a direct kidney issue but most of it is going to be caused by
imbalances of vitamins & nutrients, etc. Once you can get those corrected, I feel that his overall
blood ratio values will greatly improve.
Have you stopped all supplementation for now, for a couple of weeks to detox & flush out his
system right now? I feel that would be a good idea.
That is a great sign however, he is so active.
I agree, try using a different substrate/bedding for him, so it doesn't impact him. Try non adhesive
textured slate tiles, brown butcher's paper, reptile carpet or felt.

I owe you an email, so I will make more comments via email to you also. Let us know how he
is doing.

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Re: bad blood test result

Postby kingofnobbys » Sat Jun 08, 2019 11:54 pm

exoticliz wrote:
kingofnobbys wrote:The acquarium thermometer will be most accurate of the two.
Get some more (thermometers with probes on long cables) , I recommend 2 or 3 so you can monitor air (zone) temperatures and surface temperatures and see these at a glance.

hello,
im orderd few thermometers with probes on long cables and without cables.
I think I will get the goods on Monday or Tuesday

kingofnobbys wrote:<<<< maybe someone else will chime in here - like I already stated - i'm not a vet.

i understood :) i want believe what new UVB fix thats calcium issue:(

kingofnobbys wrote:<<< I think improved diet, with better UV source, the corrected temperatures and calcium will improve this, maybe someone else will chime in here .

please look my post about 3 UVB tube bulb links, what i can get in my country and how fast i can do it. please help me make right choice.

kingofnobbys wrote:<<<< your vet thinks the dragon is suffering hypercalcemia ? This might be the case , need also to get the P down too.

my vet thinks the dragon got problem with kidney. but dont have any medicine for reptiles.. in my country popular only cats and dogs....

kingofnobbys wrote:I don't see a reflector (slip on type or reflector hood) so the dragon wont be receiving nearly enough UVA or UVB from it at the distances you mention.

The dragon needs to get within 5cm of the T8 10%UVB naked tube to receive sufficient UVA & UVB.
No reflector ==> 1/2x the level for the same source w/reflector.

I'd upgrade it to a T5HO 12% UVB tube with either a slip on reflector or a reflector hood.
Doing this upgrade will have an immediate effect , see information below :

a very large increase in UVA & UVB , and good levels of UVA & UVB if the dragon can get within 30cm of the tube.

today i installed reflectors. maybe it is wrong reflector.. but only that i was able to get without waiting for delivery.
T5HO i can found only 30 cm long tube, not 60.. and i must to wait 4-5 business day for delivery, can i wait that period? maybe while waiting for normal t5 bulb i can install few t8 tubes?
im really scare what 4-5 days is really long..

<<< that wont be an issue . Is it sunny where you are , you could take beardie outside to sit in the sun on your lap or chest or tummy for maybe an hour every few days , this will help boost his metabolism and immune system and vitD3 levels.

kingofnobbys wrote:Vitamin B supplementation : did the vet say why he is doing this ?

vet says that B vitamins and glucose is need for beardy while him not interesting in food.

kingofnobbys wrote:Ask about giving the dragon a lick of some Vegemite each day from a teaspoon : https://vegemite.com.au/ ,

this will give the dragon a rich source of vitB, sodium, and some extra protein.

I'm sure you can buy a small bottle or a tube of Vegemite online in your country if you can't find it in the supermarket.
the stuff is a great source of vitB and most animals love the taste.

yesterday im ordered from ebay few bottles of vegamite. today i printed that product composition and tomorrow go to supermarket and try to find some analogue.
kingofnobbys wrote:Bedding : what is that gritty stuff you are using for a substrate ?

if it's indigestible it's a danger to her , and if she eats enough of it (accidentially with her food) it's a serious impaction risk.
I'd get rid of it and replace with either absorbant paper toweling (like everyone has in their pantry - comes in roll) and or ceramic floor tiles.

Image
Made from 100% pure organic fibre Binds liquid and odour effectively inside the fibre and boasts up to 3 times higher yield than mineral-based cat litters Compostable 100% biodegradable.

that is for cats, and i really read many forums and see a lot of video about it for beardy, it crashes in water and my beardy within 6 months do not eat any pieces of food during a meal and never found any interest in this product. But if i change it and it helps me with beardy - i do it.

<<<< I'd definitely be ditching that horrible kitty litter junk. Is very nasty stuff and will hold moisture and be great media for molds, viruses and bacteria to go in. And it's not digestable either.
Better off buying some Scott-towel or equivalent (absorbant paper toweling) ,or raiding the pantry and laying a couple of layers of the paper sheeting down as the bedding. Makes for very easy cleanup, simply lift out the soiled or wet sheets and replace.


kingofnobbys wrote:will only help with a bearded dragon's hydration IF THE DRAG DRINKS the water. They DO NOT absorb moisture via their vent or through their skin , they are arid zone reptiles .

my beardy never drink water.. im many times.. give them container with water but beardy not interested in water. Sometimes i put cricket in water and beardy catch it and get water with cricket :)

i try to assist him drink water

[color=#FF0000]Dragons with renal issues (problems with their kidneys) tend to become very thirsty . I'd pass that onto the vet.

Dripping water on the dragon's snout and allowing the drops to drain to the lips will encourage a dragon to drink (if it's feeling thirsty).
Giving live insects such as silkworms is a very way of getting a dragon some hydration.
Giving fresh leafy greens and moisture rich veg and fruit ( strawberries , kiwi fruit say) will help hydrate a dragon , even if you have to handfeed these in small pieces.
[/color]
CBDs: Cleopatra & Caesar born 28Jan19.
Puff (RIP 10Dec15),Rex (RIP 16Mar17),Toothless (RIP 26Nov17).Peppa (RIP 22Mar19).
EBTSs : George & Mildred (born july 2010).
EWSs : Fluffy - 4yr rescued lawnmowing accident victim 14Nov17.
Lucky - cat attack rescue, fatal SI RIP 21Jul2010.
Wriggles - rescued injured ,thought she was a big lizard, over 8 yrs old, RIP 2Feb16. .
Gecko : Godzilla the hatchling GEHYRA GECKO (hatched May 2019)
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