Beardie has no joints... please help!

This forum is for urgent health concerns, where your beardie seems very ill and you need immediate help!

Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby WarpedHowl » Thu Jan 23, 2020 12:45 pm

Hello, I have a 7 month old bearded dragon and for the past couple weeks I noticed he was bending his feet back when relaxing, I thought it was early signs of MBD because he walks fine, runs fine and doesn't everything else fine, so I figured bring him to the bet to be sure and get it solved right away.... well, long story short, she ruled that out and thought maybe it was adenovirus. But he's on his own and has no way, so she brought him to thales back and performed an xray and turns out his bones haven't been absorbing the calcium at all. I give him rep-cal calcium with vitamin D3 teice a week and a vitamin and calcium no D3 supplement everyday. He acts fine, but in the cray, his joints are literally gone (I'll post pic) and his light which is a TH 50 10.0 is only kept 10inches away from him. The vet said it could be due to genetics and over breeding, and he only has about a 5% chance of living for a while and I grew attached to him... does any body have solutions to help him get through this? I don't wanna lose him. But if it gets bad enough he can't take care of himself, I don't want him to suffer and would euthanize him. But he can still walk fine, just his arms go more to the side and the only thing keeping his bones where his joints would be are his muscles. The vet gave me some injections to see if maybe his bones that are still there will absorb the calcium better, but his joints won't be able to come back now...
WarpedHowl
Newbie Poster
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:37 pm
- Advertisement -
- Advertisement -

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby DorgEndo » Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:02 pm

I didn't see the picture yet. Getting that up may give some of the much more experienced keepers more to work with.

What is the vet's follow up plan? How long to get injections before checking the x-ray again. Then we know how much time you have to hopefully improve things. Was any blood test done to see the blood levels of calcium, phosphorus, uric acid, etc (aka the standard reptile chemistries) ?

What foods are giving with the supplements? People here can double check there aren't any risky foods. Right now mealworms or superworms should be off the menu completely. BSFL (aka Phoenix worms) are a higher calcium insect that would be a better choice. Feed dark leafy greens every day and a variety of vegetables, squash, and some fruit. Maybe the vet could give you a list of foods she recommends for higher calcium load in the food as well
1 dragon Devlyn, 1 tree frog Charlie, 1 cat Greysie, & lots of plants
User avatar
DorgEndo
Juvie Poster
 
Posts: 435
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:51 am
Location: MN, USA

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby KarrieRee » Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:07 pm

please clarify the UVB -- did you mean a T 5 HO 10.0 Reptisun bulb?
Karrie
KarrieRee
BD.org Addict
 
Posts: 5648
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2018 7:24 am

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby WarpedHowl » Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:14 pm

[Click image to enlarge]
[Click image to enlarge]
WarpedHowl
Newbie Poster
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:37 pm

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby WarpedHowl » Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:25 pm

He has the tube, and it's almost 6 months. I'm gonna get it replaced start of February. And he eats mainly collard greens and dandelion greens, but he likes bok choy, so I only put a little bit of that in his food to get him eating the greens, which also have butternut squash and sphagetti squash too. I wanted to find him Phoenix worms, but I live in Canada Alberta and I don'tbelieve they'rebrought here, same with the dubia roaches I heard good things about. Once a week I give blueberries since he likes those, only about 5 max, and small enough. I feed him gut loaded crickets with a calcium food thing, and then dust them with the supplements I previously stated. I've tried my best in raising him, always double checking certain things to make sure they're safe, bringing him to the vet to make sure he didn't have too many parasites and what not and then this happens. I was hoping to have him for a while but now they say he might not have long. I took stuff he can climb from his tank so he doesn't fall and knock his bones out of place and can't walk. And after the xray, they didn't do the blood test because you can see that his bones are fading. I didn't think about the rest of the stuff otherwise I would have told them to do a quick blood test. The injection happen once every 48 hours and they said depending on how I think he's going, try to bring him in again in about 2 weeks and check on him
WarpedHowl
Newbie Poster
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:37 pm

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby CooperDragon » Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:29 pm

Can you post some photos of him? He looks OK in the photo you posted and it's fairly common for them to let their legs and arms flop all over, especially when they sleep. The xray seems to show good bone density because of the brightness. I see the areas around the joints that appear disconnected but that may be an illusion for some reason or another. If she is able to stand and move then his joints are likely working properly.
Image
User avatar
CooperDragon
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 25160
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:41 am
Location: Iowa City, IA

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby WarpedHowl » Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:31 pm

CooperDragon wrote:Can you post some photos of him? He looks OK in the photo you posted and it's fairly common for them to let their legs and arms flop all over, especially when they sleep. The xray seems to show good bone density because of the brightness. I see the areas around the joints that appear disconnected but that may be an illusion for some reason or another. If she is able to stand and move then his joints are likely working properly.


His bones are staying in place due to the muscles. On his front right arm, the bone is knocked out. And when he walks or rest, you can see that his leg rolls to the side. Hut I'll have to post more pictures later, I'm now at work and don't have my laptop
WarpedHowl
Newbie Poster
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:37 pm

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby KarrieRee » Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:32 pm

Ok so the T 5 tube is a Reptisun ? If that is the case I would get it into his tank no cover on the bulb - exposed - have him 12-15 inches from that spot he can sit directly under it - that will be a start of the absorption of the calcium --- as far as the rest of the medical stuff I cant help w/ that but there are people on here that can help--- Tracie our vet moderator would be the most likely person -- she is on at nite --- have you tried googling BSFL on your google search -- it seems you can get them there --- and yes they would be good to feed him as they are high in calcium -
Karrie
KarrieRee
BD.org Addict
 
Posts: 5648
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2018 7:24 am
- Advertisement -
- Advertisement -

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby Drache613 » Fri Jan 24, 2020 12:41 am

Hello,

The T5 Reptisun is a great light. It is on top of the screen correct? If so, then how far is the
light from your dragon?
We recommend getting your dragon within a 12 or so inch distance from the light unobstructed
for maximum benefits.
I highly recommend getting him on a liquid calcium as soon as you can. If I am viewing those
x-rays correctly, I definitely see bone deterioration which would explain why he doesn't have a
lot of strength. His skull bone is very dull at the base & so are his hipbones. This happens very
often when their body starts leaching calcium from the bones to maintain the proper blood serum
calcium. So I see exactly what the vet is talking about with regards to the joints, etc. How long
has he been having this trouble?
Can you post pictures of his tank setup so we can see the lighting placement please, that would
help a lot.

Tracie
User avatar
Drache613
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 39298
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:33 pm
Location: May, Texas

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby WarpedHowl » Sat Jan 25, 2020 3:51 pm

[Click image to enlarge]
[Click image to enlarge]
[Click image to enlarge]


Here's more pictures of him and his tank set up. I just switched it a few days ago from sand mat as it was getting old and vet said it can hurt their feet. And due to this it's better to remove it. I recently had a hammock and everything in his tank, but vet told me to remove anything he can fall off from so he doesn't knock his bones outta place. I just bought the liquid calcium last night now too, thank you for the suggestion. I had his light placed inside his tank since September as how it's shown. I executed most husbandry properly, always checking something if I wasn't sure
WarpedHowl
Newbie Poster
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:37 pm

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby WarpedHowl » Sat Jan 25, 2020 3:52 pm

KarrieRee wrote:Ok so the T 5 tube is a Reptisun ? If that is the case I would get it into his tank no cover on the bulb - exposed - have him 12-15 inches from that spot he can sit directly under it - that will be a start of the absorption of the calcium --- as far as the rest of the medical stuff I cant help w/ that but there are people on here that can help--- Tracie our vet moderator would be the most likely person -- she is on at nite --- have you tried googling BSFL on your google search -- it seems you can get them there --- and yes they would be good to feed him as they are high in calcium -
Karrie


Thank you, I've taken a look at her website and have ordered some poenix worms. Hopefuly they don't take long to get here
WarpedHowl
Newbie Poster
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:37 pm

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby WarpedHowl » Sat Jan 25, 2020 3:57 pm

For his tank, I know there's nothing really under the basking bulb for him. He gets upset when I move his small rock to being under it and all stressed out. So when I'm not feeding him his crickets, I put his blanket under it. That way he can semi-clumb but still be comfy and he seems to like it. Opening his mouth often to vent out if he gets to hot. Also with his water bowl, the vet recommended I did that back when I first had him. It doesn't affect his humidity levels, then never increase more that 30% and he only goes in once every other day I've noticed. I also only have a heater under the water to keep it warm so it's not cold
WarpedHowl
Newbie Poster
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:37 pm

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby Drache613 » Sun Jan 26, 2020 11:01 pm

Hello,

How is your boy doing this evening?
Are you using a digital probe to measure his temperatures to be sure that he isn't getting
too hot? Do you use the under tank heater only during the night?
The tube is a bit too far from him, especially with it being on top of the screen. Perhaps
you could try to get it mounted underneath of the screen so he can get a stronger UVB
exposure? You can use the 3M Command hooks, or just wire to tie it to the screen.

Let us know how he is doing.
Tracie
User avatar
Drache613
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 39298
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:33 pm
Location: May, Texas

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby kingofnobbys » Mon Jan 27, 2020 8:10 am

If your dragon can crawl and hold it's own body weight off the ground it's got functioning joints in it's arms and legs .

Tucking hands and feet in is a common bearded dragon resting behavior. Some are lazy and walk on the wrists too with hands tucked in.

Xray's been photoshopped I expect.
CBDs: Cleopatra & Caesar born 28Jan19.
Puff (RIP 10Dec15),Rex (RIP 16Mar17),Toothless (RIP 26Nov17).Peppa (RIP 22Mar19).
EBTSs : George & Mildred (born july 2010).
EWSs : new rescues Cheakie (subadult M) Nov 2019, Gutzy (F) 27Sep19, Fluffy (F) rescued injured by lawnwacker 14Nov17, Wriggles (F) - injured rescue, over 8 yrs old, RIP 2Feb16 old age. Lucky juvenile (M) - cat attack rescue (lost r-eye, broken r-lower jaw), fatal SI RIP 21Jul2010.
kingofnobbys
BD.org Sicko
 
Posts: 11311
Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 10:56 pm

Re: Beardie has no joints... please help!

Postby WarpedHowl » Mon Jan 27, 2020 7:59 pm

Drache613 wrote:Hello,

How is your boy doing this evening?
Are you using a digital probe to measure his temperatures to be sure that he isn't getting
too hot? Do you use the under tank heater only during the night?
The tube is a bit too far from him, especially with it being on top of the screen. Perhaps
you could try to get it mounted underneath of the screen so he can get a stronger UVB
exposure? You can use the 3M Command hooks, or just wire to tie it to the screen.

Let us know how he is doing.
Tracie


He seems to still be going alright. And I do, he seems to get hot easily so I moved his basking light a little away from him to help. His UVB light is already propped under his tank, It's being held by metal hinges. I took the screen off back when I moved his light further down
WarpedHowl
Newbie Poster
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:37 pm
- Advertisement -
- Advertisement -

Next

Return to Beardie ER

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot], Saffron304