Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby SquirkyTurtle » Sat Nov 23, 2019 5:28 pm

Hey!

Quick update, we went back to the vet today. We have had a few good and a few bad days, including days where he didn't eat at all. We also noticed his last good leg went early this week which makes movement for him even harder.

The vet gave us some more meds and he also gave us some seringe feed to substitute on days we can't get him to eat, as there was a drop in weight as well as reduced alertness in his behaviour over the last week.

He suggested there might be a chance that he has some more serious issues, possibly connected to his kidneys. There is no evidence for this right now other then some swellings and his decreasing state despite him having substitutes and proper husbandry. They struggled getting blood from him for testing.

Obviously this is not a fast road to recovery but the vet also suggested that we should consider discussing helping him with his struggles if there is no visual improvement within the next three weeks when our next check up is.

After we brought him home he perked up a little and I managed to get him to eat two dubias. As he hadn't had food in days we also gave him some seringe food. I really hope he gets better, we are going to continue trying all we can.
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby claudiusx » Sat Nov 23, 2019 7:18 pm

Hi there,

So did they manage to get enough blood to do some tests? Hopefully so. Make sure you post up the levels here for us to look at.

What meds did they give?
The slurry is a good idea, especially if he has lost weight. What did they suggest?

-Brandon
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby SquirkyTurtle » Sun Nov 24, 2019 3:42 am

Heya!

No they haven't managed to get any blood but I think they might possibly try again in three weeks.

We have calcium, pain killers & some antibiotics for a swelling on his wrist (only 2 days worth left of this one).

He said we should try and feed him normally but if he doesn't eat we should give him 1 ml of the slurry to help him out.
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby AHBD » Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:53 am

Hi there, just read your thread for the first time and sorry for the problems your beardie is having. What is his name [ sorry if I missed it ] I think the pain meds. are an appetite killer and should not be prescribed. Many beardies with MBD maintain an appetite but metacam and other pain meds. can cause appetite loss and along with antibiotics can easily even cause stomach, kidney + liver issues . I would get him off of those altogether. Best wishes to your little guy !
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby skyfishcafe » Sun Nov 24, 2019 12:45 pm

Hi there, thanks for the update. It sounds like it really has been a rollercoaster. I'm sorry things have been rough in recent days, particularly with not eating and changes in behavior. About two or three weeks after beginning treatment was when our little one was showing extremely limited mobility, too. Like you, we're still using small (0.01cc) doses of the meloxicam daily for pain management (except for days when he refuses to eat, since we inject the meds into his feeder insects).

I've wondered about how the kidneys might be affected by the treatment in our case, too. With all the swelling, there was a point that I seriously wondered if we were dealing with gout in our juvenile. I don't know exactly what you're seeing, of course, but in our case it seems the swelling is caused by hypertrophic growth indicative of the body's compensating for the weakened bone structure. (EDITED 11/25/2019: This may not actually be the case. It seems our little guy, like yours, may have an infection.)

I know this situation is hard, and it sucks, and it's not fair for him or for the rest of your family. For now, all we can do is one day at a time. You and your family are doing your best! And I'm sure I don't have to tell you that your dragon is much better off with you than he would be with many, many other potential keepers in the world.

Hang in there! We are rooting for you.

With kind regards,
Aaron
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby skyfishcafe » Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:12 am

Hi there,

Just wanted to check in to see how you and your little one have been doing since your last update!

With kind regards,
Aaron
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby SquirkyTurtle » Fri Dec 20, 2019 7:38 am

Hey,

Sorry for this really late update, we had a lot going on over the last few weeks and quite a lot of vet visits as well.

After my last post our little guy was given liquid food every day and sadly completely went off his normal food, no matter how much we tried. I literally bought every single bug out there I knew he could have, to convince him to eat, but I had no success. Something to note though, even if he wasn't eating, he seemed to have a lot of thirst.

On the bright side, after a few weeks of constant slurpies and meds, the affects of his MDB went away completely. He was walking and standing again like a champ just like he did before it started. His swellings also receeded and he looked more like himself. I really thought things were looking up and he also seemed to regain his energy. We had a good few days but not eating was worrying us like crazy and we noticed that he was loosing weight even tho he was getting constant liquid food. Additionally, his poop started looking a lot less brown and more clear and more jello like every day. He also went from one poop every few days to more frequent smaller jello poops. His urates were unchanged.

We took him back to the vet and our worries were confirmed, the vet took his weight and was very alarmed. She advised we should try for blood again (didn't work last time), do fecals and double the amount of slurpie to twice a day. After succeeding with the blood we took him home and from that day on, we noticed an instant visible recline. Even though he got double food, he seemed to have less energy every day and kept loosing weight. One night I saw him wandering in his tank restlessly instead of sleeping. In Tuesday (two days, before blood test results), I woke up to him lying in one spot breathing lightly and sleeping. Normally in the mornings he's most active and his light was already on.

I had a bad feeling so instead of waiting for the results, we booked a vet appointment for the next day. Sadly, by the time we got home from work that same day, he had passed. This hit us very had as we really believed he was on his way up for a bit.

I was going to write this post then but I choose to wait for the blood test results which we got yesterday. Our and the vets suspicion was confirmed and he had failing kidneys. The vet said there was nothing we could have done and if he wouldn't have passed himself, she would have suggested to put him to sleep. She assumed that his kidneys were also the blame for the issues with MDB he had and this was probably a long recline.

This is super depressing but I'm relieved he's no longer in pain. He was on pain meds until the very end so I hope he didn't suffer too much.

Thanks for all your help here, I felt like you guys deserved a final update even if its a sad one. I just hope the few weeks he had at ours before getting ill, he was happy. Rest in piece baby.
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby Drache613 » Sat Dec 21, 2019 6:00 pm

Hello,

Oh dear, I am so very sorry that you lost him, & around the holidays no less. :cry: Though
there is never a nice time to lose one. He put up a good fight for you & at least he wasn't alone
though & you were with him.
I hope you & your family are all doing ok.

Tracie
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby claudiusx » Sat Dec 21, 2019 6:10 pm

Dang I'm so sorry to hear about this. It's so hard when they seem to be making a come back and then regress all of a sudden. I know how you must be feeling right now. A lot of us have been through this. We are here for you.

What levels were high exactly? If you could post the blood results it would be interesting to see.

Once again, so sorry for your loss.

-Brandon
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby skyfishcafe » Mon Dec 23, 2019 7:55 pm

I'm sorry it turned out this way for you and your family :( It's so hard going from hopeful to... well, it's a real loss. You gave your little one the best shot he had. I hope you are able to take some time and space to grieve.
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby SquirkyTurtle » Sat Jan 11, 2020 5:08 pm

Hey everyone,

sorry for this late reply, we were grieving for a bit and I took a little break from coming back here. We now had a little bit of time to deal with the death of our little guy and to think about the future and I am in desperate need of advice and input in a few areas.

Just to answer your question Brandon, we don't actually have the results. I am tempted to call our vet and ask for them to be sent to us, but I wasn't really thinking too clearly when they told us and I did not really consider requesting them. If I get them, I will post them here first thing. I do recall the vet saying that the results pointed towards a kidney problem and that there was nothing we could have done and if he hadn't passed naturally, she would have suggested to bring him in to put him to sleep.

Now that we have had some time to think about this, we obviously started worrying a bit about what the cause of the issue was. We really watched out with out husbandry so its hard to believe we caused him to be ill but there is always a nagging bit in my mind that worries we might have done something wrong. If any of you have any thoughts about this, please let me know, I will appreciate this.

We also have been slowly starting to think about our very empty sad tank and the possiblity of filling it with new life again in the next few weeks to come. This is a bit scary considdering what happened but I also don't want to be beaten down by this. Its quite a tough situation, I haven't really had to deal with this kind of loss before. If we considdered adopting another baby, I am not even really sure where to start, if I am honest.

I am very unsure wether we need to tear everything out of the tank and sterilise it before we even considder adding a new beardy in the enviroment? The last thing we would ever want to happen is for something like this to reuccur. This is quite a hard decision as a lot of love and work went into the tank. We build a big foam and solicone landscape, planted it and there is a bioactive cleanup crew in there which would have to go. I could really use some advise on this.

We have received some critique from a shop employee advising us that we should never have gone bioactive with a bearded dragon and that they assumed we caused whatever happened with the setup. This was really hard to hear. I very carefully did my research and I checked every single thing that went into the tank over but I do understand that the experience of the person giving me the feedback outweight mine by quite a lot and I am very willing to accept critisim. Therefore I am not feeling too comforable to consider proceeding with my current setup.

All of this is very confusing and if anyone has any input about anything, I will appreciate it. Also thank you for being there for me. This forum has been really great and I appreciate the community a lot.
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Re: Help! Young beardy diagnosed with Mbd is worse again

Postby AHBD » Sat Jan 11, 2020 6:56 pm

Hey there, I can imagine the turmoil with deciding what to do as far as getting another dragon and also the negative feedback on the bioactive tank. I don't think your dragon had anything contagious , I still believe it was the combination of meds. that easily overwhelmed his kidneys. Metacam is actually not usually given to cats because of how easily it causes kidney failure so it may very well also do it for a much smaller animal.

That being said I think your tank would be fine for another dragon but maybe not a small baby. That's my 2 cents. Best wishes + happy hunting for your new dragon. Make the decision that you feel most comfortable with. :)
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