Female being territorial?

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IzzyLou24

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We got two girls, both about a year old, about 2 weeks ago.
They were cohabiting but we separated them, and today the much smaller one, Aurora, started head bobbing, black bearding and really puffing up when she spotted her big brother (5yo Spike,who was in his vivarium)
I know this is standard male territorial behaviour, however the store we got them from assured us that they were both female.
It all adds up really; they were both very well behaved when cohabiting (They loved to cuddle up), Aurora is much smaller than her sister and is the one showing these behaviours.
However, when we checked we couldn't see any male sex organs.
If anyone has any idea what's going on we would really appreciate it!!
Thanks,
Izzy, Saphira and Aurora xxx
 

kingofnobbys

BD.org Sicko
It does happen, I had a female who was very much a blackbearder and headbanger. Very bossy little thing. Yes females can be territorial . My bossyboots was also smaller.



Are you sure both are females though.
 

KarrieRee

BD.org Sicko
Beardie name(s)
Hiccup he is 6 and Blaze is 4
It is best to keep them apart---- I would post pics of the 3 w/ tails in the air and see if some of us on here can help w/ the sexing- take pics form the rear of course w/ tails up so we can see the vent
Karrie
 

kingofnobbys

BD.org Sicko
KarrieRee":a4s6ti91 said:
It is best to keep them apart---- I would post pics of the 3 w/ tails in the air and see if some of us on here can help w/ the sexing- take pics form the rear of course w/ tails up so we can see the vent
Karrie

Yep , asking for trouble if this pair are rehoused together.

Not all F + F pairs are harmonious , eventually the bigger attacks the smaller.
Also , unless reared together from very young hatchlings , best to not keep dragons together if there is large size difference.
Only reason why my Caesar and Cleo are good together so far ( 7 months old) is Caesar doesn't know Cleo is half his size , I provide two basking spots, two hides and they are never fed together. ( I don't expect this harmonious coexistence to last forever and will be separating the pair soon as my garden and house improvements are done ).
 

IzzyLou24

Member
Original Poster
Thank you all :)

I didn't plan on getting both of them. Only found out there was a second girl in the vivarium when I was picking my girl up, but I just could not leave her behind! Ordered a new vivarium as soon as I got home but they were perfectly happy together, all cuddled up.
105937-9100955198.jpg
They're all separated now, seem to be doing ok. Aurora Is in the top vivarium, and isn't going through too much relocation stress, she loves looking out the window :)
Kept Saphira in the lower one as she was very stressed after she moved.
105937-6506233131.jpg

Will get some pics of Aurora tomorrow, my working hours mean that I'm not home while their lights are on until tomorrow afternoon :(

If Aurora is actually a male then we're going to rename her Artura!!

Thanks again :)
Izzy, Saphira and Aurora xx
 

kingofnobbys

BD.org Sicko
Another point, what's the gravelly stuff I can see in the picture.

Not a good or safe substrate for bearded dragons , high impaction risk. I'd get rid of that stuff and replace with nonparticulate substate.
 

KarrieRee

BD.org Sicko
Beardie name(s)
Hiccup he is 6 and Blaze is 4
Also the tanks are beautiful but the UVB's need reflectors --- they are mounted nn the back wall and the dragons cant get under them so the UVB is not effective --- I would get them to where they can sit directly under them and get a reflector on them ---
Karrie
 

IzzyLou24

Member
Original Poster
kingofnobbys":3hnwxkbk said:
Another point, what's the gravelly stuff I can see in the picture.

Not a good or safe substrate for bearded dragons , high impaction risk. I'd get rid of that stuff and replace with nonparticulate substate.

It's corn cob, very soft, foam like substrate. Not caused any problems with my partner's 6yo beardie who's been on it for 5 years but I'm planning on swapping out half the vivarium for tiles (the side with the food). Saphira loves to hide under her log and dig out the substrate to create a wall for hiding so I don't want to take that away from her :)
 

IzzyLou24

Member
Original Poster
KarrieRee":2up33i8z said:
Also the tanks are beautiful but the UVB's need reflectors --- they are mounted nn the back wall and the dragons cant get under them so the UVB is not effective --- I would get them to where they can sit directly under them and get a reflector on them ---
Karrie

Thanks for the advice! Will get some reflectors ASAP and have a look where I can move the tubes to :) I try to put their climbing things on the back wall under the UVB, still kitting out Saphira's for the back wall though, work in progress!
 

Claudiusx

BD.org Sicko
Staff member
Moderator
Hi there, the tubes are ok at the back but putting a reflector on them will definitely help :)

The important thing is the distance from bulb to basking surface. In a lot of my tanks it's near the back, but I also have most of my basking sites near the back.

-Brandon
 

kingofnobbys

BD.org Sicko
IzzyLou24":21b6sz99 said:
kingofnobbys":21b6sz99 said:
Another point, what's the gravelly stuff I can see in the picture.

Not a good or safe substrate for bearded dragons , high impaction risk. I'd get rid of that stuff and replace with nonparticulate substate.

It's corn cob, very soft, foam like substrate. Not caused any problems with my partner's 6yo beardie who's been on it for 5 years but I'm planning on swapping out half the vivarium for tiles (the side with the food). Saphira loves to hide under her log and dig out the substrate to create a wall for hiding so I don't want to take that away from her :)

Corn cob bedding is highly absorbant = a perfect media for bacteria, viruses and mold, and will be also make it harder to control the relative humidity in the tank. For those reasons alone I'd be ditching it , might be for rodents and mammals and birds , but not for arid zone reptiles to live on.
 

kingofnobbys

BD.org Sicko
Regarding position of UVB tube :
Penetration-distances-for-a-24-inch-high-x-26-inch-deep-tank-for.png


A good polished metallic (parabolic profile) reflector or hood with polished metallic reflector built-in will essentially double the UVA & UVB fluxes at any position under the reflector , no UV is wasted .

Is better to have the UV source directly overtop the basking spot, than along a back wall's top corner.
 

IzzyLou24

Member
Original Poster
kingofnobbys":1f0ix3bh said:
IzzyLou24":1f0ix3bh said:
kingofnobbys":1f0ix3bh said:
Another point, what's the gravelly stuff I can see in the picture.

Not a good or safe substrate for bearded dragons , high impaction risk. I'd get rid of that stuff and replace with nonparticulate substate.

It's corn cob, very soft, foam like substrate. Not caused any problems with my partner's 6yo beardie who's been on it for 5 years but I'm planning on swapping out half the vivarium for tiles (the side with the food). Saphira loves to hide under her log and dig out the substrate to create a wall for hiding so I don't want to take that away from her :)

Corn cob bedding is highly absorbant = a perfect media for bacteria, viruses and mold, and will be also make it harder to control the relative humidity in the tank. For those reasons alone I'd be ditching it , might be for rodents and mammals and birds , but not for arid zone reptiles to live on.

So what loose substrate would you recommend?

Thank you for the advice and diagrams ?
 

IzzyLou24

Member
Original Poster
Sorry all, I had some issues uploading this image for you guys to have a look; this is what we can see.

105937-7324328930.jpg

I'm 95% sure Aurora is actually male; Saphira was waving at her from the vivarium while Aurora was helping me with their salads, and Aurora black bearded again, bobbed her head and was puffed right up trying to jump to Saphira's vivarium. They both got really, really stressed out when we wouldn't let them be near each other, I ended up covering Saphira's viv so they couldn't see each other (at which point Saphira started running into the glass ?‍♀️)

TIA
Izzy
 
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