Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Aaradimian » Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:49 am

I wonder if he might have eaten some bark. Is it of a size where that'd have been a possibility?
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Ash1 » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:12 pm

Aaradimian wrote:I wonder if he might have eaten some bark. Is it of a size where that'd have been a possibility?


I don't think so...the reason we bought that particular bark was because it was so large. Each piece is close to 3/4 - 1 inch in diameter.

And he has pooped the last couple days, although a smaller amount since he is not eating much.
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Ash1 » Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:12 pm

Okay, I'm really really worried now... We just walked in to check on Ash and he looked dead. He was laying down, limbs tucked in, eyes closed and head laying down and didn't look to be breathing.

He opened his eyes after I touched him, and I could see him lightly slowly breathing then. We're trying to give him a warm bath and he's just laying there, eyes closed.

He is able to move, but won't do so without prompting.

He does not seem to have an impaction. I'm not even sure this is MBD?

I force fed him three crickets late last night, finally got some in. I gave him some more calcium water earlier today in a syringe. Still won't eat.

Is there something else that could be going on???
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Ash1 » Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:15 pm

Okay, I'm really really worried now... We just walked in to check on Ash and he looked dead. He was laying down, limbs tucked in, eyes closed and head laying down and didn't look to be breathing.

He opened his eyes after I touched him, and I could see him lightly slowly breathing then. We're trying to give him a warm bath and he's just laying there, eyes closed. He did stay on the basking spot all day where I put him, and he keeps moving to cold spots. He seems like he's trying to go into brumation, although I know he's so young! I just don't understand what's going on.

He is able to move, but won't do so without prompting.

He does not seem to have an impaction. I'm not even sure this is MBD?

I force fed him three crickets late last night, finally got some in. I gave him some more calcium water earlier today in a syringe. Still won't eat.

Is there something else that could be going on???
[Click image to enlarge]

[Click image to enlarge]
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Ash1 » Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:05 pm

I'm wondering if he could possibly have a parasite? I noticed that one of the symptoms was strong smelling stool, and we had noticed this last week. It smelled up the whole room and you could smell it as soon as walking in the room.
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Aaradimian » Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:47 am

Ash1 wrote:I'm wondering if he could possibly have a parasite? I noticed that one of the symptoms was strong smelling stool, and we had noticed this last week. It smelled up the whole room and you could smell it as soon as walking in the room.


Parasites can cause them to lose weight. Not sure about appetite or stool smell. If you haven't already, you might want to PM Drachie613 (Tracie), one of the moderators & a vet. She's good with tougher cases. I see she responded earlier. Were you able to look at the lighting? It does sound like he's not well, but my only suggestion would be a vet visit since I'm kinda new to this.
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby AHBD » Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:56 am

Hi there sorry to hear about Ash's troubles. :( How long have you had him ? The number one culprit is that he went so long without good uvb. His symptoms all point to that. It's good that you now have a proper uvb bulb but it will take time until he gets better. He may also have swallowed a wood chip. BTW, how are you measuring the tank temps., how many watts is your heat bulb ? He would need at least a 150 to keep the temps. up. Also remove any hiding places so he is exposed the the heat + uvb. If it's warm outside take him in the sun, just on your lap or in the grass. Try some Reptaboost and Repashy Grub pie + add extra water to keep him hydrated.
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Drache613 » Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:38 am

Hello,

I agree, for now, until we figure out what could be going on, as suggested, go ahead & remove
some of his hides, etc so he will have to bask & get his UVB lighting. He did go awhile without
good UVB so my guess is that he has metabolici bone disease & is just in a weakened state. I
wouldn't let him sleep or hide in excess because he wont get his needed lighting to recover.
How old is he again? Did the vet do a blood test on him?
I feel that might be warranted to fully determine his levels.
Are you trying to get any food into him?

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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Ash1 » Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:56 am

Thank you all...

We got Ash almost 3 months ago. He is now almost 5 months old. I think he was rather young to be sold by the breeder, and was small for his age when we bought him, and has always been on the smaller side. I am concerned about his size/weight anyway, which is also a concern with him not eating now. When I weighed him yesterday (and I am not sure the accuracy is great since we are using a postage scale), but he weighed only 57 grams. He is only 10" long. Very small for his age.

I am trying to keep him awake and alert as much as possible when we are home. I will remove the excess hiding spots and the bark from the enclosure. I can not feel any bark in his belly. We are in the middle of winter here and it is very cold, so unfortunately not possible to take him outside. I think it is a 100 watt bulb for basking, but will have to double check when home. We have an infrared thermometer to check for temps and his basking spot is regularly right around 103-107 degrees F.

I am trying to get food into him, but he is not having it. He is holding his jaw together tightly so that I cannot even get food in there. I was able to force in three crickets two days ago but that was it. I was not able to get anything into him last night. No greens and no crickets and I tried multiple times. He is being very stubborn! He did let me give him some of the calcium water with a syringe and I gave him a 10 minute bath.

Should I be trying to feed him something else at this point? Maybe go for some baby food with a syringe? I will get some reptaboost and see if that helps him.

He has not been to the vet. There is no reptile vet in the area, although I did find one that looks like they do see exotics, but it is not their specialty. I have been waiting for a call back from them. We had been hoping to avoid that due to the cost and lack of a good reptile vet, but he is looking so ill, we are very worried.

Is it normal for them with MBD to go from being completely active and normal to completely lethargic and not eating within just a couple days? It seems so sudden!
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby AHBD » Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:45 pm

They can, sometimes other things are involved though. But calcium affects every single function of the body and the inability to absorb it can cause all sorts of serious health issues. Then when you try to force feed it can stress them out on top of it.
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Ash1 » Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:58 pm

So should I be trying to force feed? What's the best way to go about it, and with what kind of food?
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby AHBD » Thu Feb 14, 2019 1:05 pm

Try the Reptaboost and even add home made smoothies if you can. The Repashy grub pie can be watered down and he may like the taste of both of those products. You can also smash a bug until the guts come out a bit + rub that on his snout. Otherwise you can try this, it's for giving meds. but can work with food as well. You just have to be careful not to choke him. :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNSL7OqDzjo

I'd try dripping it on his mouth first though to see if he'll lick it up.
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Drache613 » Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:08 pm

Hello,

How is your boy doing today?
Have you been able to get any food into him recently? Calcium issues can come on so
suddenly without any warnings at all.
Right now, nutrition is extremely important for him so he can recover better. Are you able
to keep him warmer overnight right now, to help boost his immune system?
Let us know how he is doing.

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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby rubeuslupin » Mon Feb 18, 2019 10:13 pm

Hello, is there any new updates on this issue?! My dragon is having similar symptoms, I’ve only had him for 3 1/2 weeks and I’ve had a hard time getting him to eat regularly. I’ve dusted most of the crickets he has eaten, if not all, busy it’s been more difficult to get any to stick to the roaches. I finally got a good batch of BSF larvae, but he hasn’t been eating well since then so hasn’t had many. He was eating well about a week and a half ago, chasing food down and whatnot, but now will barely eat something right in front of his face. The limp arms just began early this morning, I gave him baby food squash with some coconut oil and calcium mixed in, in case it is impaction or calcium deficiency. He ate one BSFL and one dubia, and licked at the baby food mixture a little. Arms seem the same this evening, just hoping for some idea of how quickly he should improve if it is low calcium, once I get some calcium in him.

He has a reptisun 10.0 24” mounted inside the top lid facing down, a 100W basking bulb with temps around 100-110 in his hammock and 75-99degrees throughout the rest of the tank. CHE for night to keep it above 65 degrees. I’m using an infrared gun for temps.

I have moved things around more than I’d have liked since getting him, but I kept having issues with losing crickets and roaches to cracks, issues with him fighting his reflection, and needing a bigger tank and better lighting. I’d hoped he would have been more comfortable or and eating well again, as it’s been over a week now since I’ve changed anything, but now this is happening. I can’t figure out how to post a pic, but will probably just take him to a vet tommorow if he hasn’t improved.

Thank you.
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Re: Please help - Beardie front legs are limp :(

Postby Ash1 » Mon Feb 18, 2019 10:31 pm

Thanks Tracie... So sorry you're in the same boat, Rubeus.

Not really any changes to note, until today.

He's been taking the Reptaboost like a champ. And drinking his water ok. Still preferring to lay on the ground most of the day, but will bask when I put him up there. Front arms still limp. I've been keeping the room he's in at almost 80 degrees regularly, and keep his basking light on for about 16-17 hours/day.

Today though, finally, when I put some crickets in his enclosure, he ate four on his own. He only ate the ones that came near him, but, I didn't have to force it. Really hoping that continues! He seemed slightly more alert tonight also.

I'm having issues with the light. I mounted it underneath, the fish tank hood I had with a reptisun 10, but each time I put a bulb in, it burns out within 1-3 days. Returned the first one and the second burned out last night, so something isn't right there. Going to have to get another hood fairly quickly. Hoping they'll take back the second bulb since they're so expensive.

Fingers crossed for more improvement...
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