Immediate advice needed - beardie dying

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Akire

Member
You got her a few days ago (on the 8th) correct? If you're still worried I would call the pet store and see if they would cover the cost of a vet exam. Was it a big chain store you got her from? Many years ago I got a little corn snake from Petco (back when I actually shopped there) who turned out to be very ill. The store covered the expense of taking him to the exotic vet that they used for their animals. He didn't have a happy ending sadly, but I hope your little baby does!
 

AHBD

BD.org Sicko
Although it may seem like a good idea I'd skip the vet. Too many inexperienced vets do more harm than good with a baby dragon that may just need proper set up + some TLC. It's almost always best to let a tiny dragon get some weight + size on before a vet visit....you'd be surprised at how sick they can get after a stressful visit to a vet that may prescribe meds. or other treatment that causes a setback just when things are looking a little bit better.

Besides, this dragon was purchased as a gift far away in another town so that's out.
 

Akire

Member
That's why I said if they are still worried; so basically only if the beardie isn't improving. Otherwise I agree that the stress could mess up her improvement. It seems like she is doing significantly better now. Like you said though, it doesn't matter anyway because the pet store was far away. Somehow I missed that bit on info when I was reading all the posts, haha. It happens.

Good luck with your baby! I hope she keeps improving :D
 

newbeardiegma

Member
Original Poster
AHBD":1dle5jd0 said:
If you get live food tonight give her no more than 2-3 bugs, and be sure they are no longer than the space between her eyes. You can even post a picture of them to show the size so someone can advise. Buy 1/4" crickets.....you can actually order 500-1,000 1/4 " crix to be delivered overnight from Millbrook cricket farm If you order them tonight or tomorrow they will come on Friday. Don't order on Friday though, you won't get them until Monday. But I'm happy to tell you that she really looks quite good, not at all near death's door. Don't let the pet store talk you into larger crickets than that, larger crix can cause impaction in a small beardie. If the only thing they had was mini mealworms you could get a tub of those and just feed a couple of them, if they have only medium ones you can get them but just feed her the fresh shed [ white + soft ] ones. But never give more than a few, and only get them if there's no other choice. No waxworms either, but if they have no crickets you might get some, those would only be good 1 at a time for this emergency.

Again, thank you SO MUCH to everyone that jumped in with advice and concern. She looks 100% better than she did this morning, and I think she's going to be fine. She just needed to train me a little :lol:

We did get 36 small crickets tonight and she gobbled a few greedily. They were not dusted with calcium, but I will make sure that the next batch I feed her is! I am going to order some small worms online tomorrow, or maybe roaches ... though this Florida girl has a real aversion to them! I also got a thermometer with probe, and a better UVB light.

Oh, and she pooped again. So the impaction has passed and things are looking up all around.

How old should she be before a visit to the vet? And is it normal for her legs to be so extremely skinny? I'm going to have to fatten her up so she matches the rest of us :D
 

kingofnobbys

BD.org Sicko
newbeardiegma":1icevirg said:
Thank you for the advice -- especially about not putting her outside in her tank. I'm wondering if this may be some of the cause of the issues as well, since she rode here in her glass tank from Central, FL. The car was air conditioned and she had no lamps/lighting during the 8ish hour trip ... so maybe all the temp and lighting fluctuation has caused her problems as well. Most certainly she is stressed to the max. I will sit with her outside this afternoon.

As an update, she had a warm bath this morning. Did not drink. Did not poop. But did lick my daughter's fingernail and ate one small bit of parsley. Not the best food, I know, but so happy that she at least ate something!

I am going to try to syringe feed her later this morning. And take her outside this afternoon. If she survives, I will order new lighting and digital thermometers tomorrow. And I'm going to call around and see if any of the bait shops carry small, live crickets or any of the smaller worms.
<<<< best not to use live insects bred and sold as fishing bait BECAUSE the bait shops add FISH ATTRACTANTS (chemicals) that are likely to be toxic to a reptile who is going to be eating lots of them everyday. (Might be OK for fish , and not an issue for the people who eat the fish who ate the insect (because the fish are gutted prior to cooking and eating).

Dr.Google is your friend , key words live reptile food usa

Here is the result : lots of places who will ship live insects in bulk (by the hundred or by the pound and to your size specifications) , who will send them by express post or courier on spec or as a regular order.
https://www.google.com.au/search?source=hp&q=live+reptile+food+usa&oq=live+reptile+food+usa&gs_l=psy-ab.12...16953.16953.0.18383.1.1.0.0.0.0.204.204.2-1.1.0....0...1..64.psy-ab..0.0.0....0.XkPQBJEfzl0
I live in North Eastern NSW (Australia) and order my crickets & mealworms and superworms and BSF lavae from insect breeders in Melbourne Victoria and The Sunshine Coast Queensland, and silkworms from breeders in Sydney NSW, Cairns (Far NE Queensland) and The Sunshine Coast Queensland. My feeders take up to two days to arrive even if sent by EXPRESS POST (some need to travel 3000 km to get to me).
So you should have no problem ordering in live insects as there are many more insect suppliers in the USA than in Australia.

Also, she did some arm waving -- both arms, one at a time -- when I put her up on her basking rock. I'm guessing she saw her reflection in the glass of the tank? Is this common?
<<< yes , is very cute when they do that .... :)
I need to do some reading on this subject. It almost looked like she was trying to get her body up off the heat of the rock ... so I'm not sure what this behavior was for if not because of discomfort.

We don't have any substance on the sides of the tank to stop reflection -- and that is probably a concern for much later -- but I wondering what is advised?

some strips of printer paper taped on the inside at her eyelevel will solve the issue of ghost beardies haunting her.
 

kingofnobbys

BD.org Sicko
newbeardiegma":2fiy0bj0 said:
AHBD":2fiy0bj0 said:
If you get live food tonight give her no more than 2-3 bugs, and be sure they are no longer than the space between her eyes. You can even post a picture of them to show the size so someone can advise. Buy 1/4" crickets.....you can actually order 500-1,000 1/4 " crix to be delivered overnight from Millbrook cricket farm If you order them tonight or tomorrow they will come on Friday. Don't order on Friday though, you won't get them until Monday. But I'm happy to tell you that she really looks quite good, not at all near death's door. Don't let the pet store talk you into larger crickets than that, larger crix can cause impaction in a small beardie. If the only thing they had was mini mealworms you could get a tub of those and just feed a couple of them, if they have only medium ones you can get them but just feed her the fresh shed [ white + soft ] ones. But never give more than a few, and only get them if there's no other choice. No waxworms either, but if they have no crickets you might get some, those would only be good 1 at a time for this emergency.

Again, thank you SO MUCH to everyone that jumped in with advice and concern. She looks 100% better than she did this morning, and I think she's going to be fine. She just needed to train me a little :lol:

We did get 36 small crickets tonight and she gobbled a few greedily. They were not dusted with calcium, but I will make sure that the next batch I feed her is! I am going to order some small worms online tomorrow, or maybe roaches ... though this Florida girl has a real aversion to them! I also got a thermometer with probe, and a better UVB light.

Oh, and she pooped again. So the impaction has passed and things are looking up all around. <<< :) , that's very encouraging .... but not out of the woods quite yet wrt impaction / GIT blockages

How old should she be before a visit to the vet? And is it normal for her legs to be so extremely skinny? I'm going to have to fatten her up so she matches the rest of us :D

A reptile vet visit for a base line health check wont hurt right now.
 

Drache613

BD.org Sicko
Staff member
Moderator
Hello,

She is so cute! :D It looks like to me, that she is already settled into her new home & is very
happy in her little towel/blankie.
If you have gotten her impaction of sorts, cleared out, she should be just fine. Once you have
improved her lighting she will improve even more. I'm so glad she's so alert & basking too. She
is going to train you I think you will find, but bonding with her should be easy. It looks like she
already loves you.

Tracie
 

kingofnobbys

BD.org Sicko
newbeardiegma":cet6encc said:
AHBD":cet6encc said:
She did just poo Ellen. :) BTW, how much was it ? If you haven't cleaned it up can you get a picture ? Was it properly formed and was there any sand or undigested food in it ?

I appreciate you guys so much! Really, thanks for all the help and advice. She is doing much better than when I found her this morning. She is holding her head up, and is alert.

The poop -- much celebrated :) -- was about 1/2 a dime size maybe? I don't know what normal poop looks like, so I have nothing to judge it against! It was black, and had a white, chalky chunk in it. (It looked similar to my bird's poop.) I cleaned it up and didn't think to take a picture or really inspect it closely.

And I went to the store before I received the post with all the good info about the capsules and syringes! We mixed prune, pumpkin, water and a little bit of olive oil. I couldn't get unflavored Pedialyte. And I tried to give this to her with the same smallish syringe that I have for administering kiddo medicine. It was a pretty fruitless experience. Dripping didn't work. And when I got it up under her lip (sort of), she laid her head on my hand and closed her eyes, clamping her jaw shut. We did get a lot of the mixture on the rest of her body, and mine as well! We gave her another warm bath to clean her off. She licked my daughter's thumb a few times and we managed to get 1 small kale leaf in her mouth.

And we took her outside, which she seemed to really enjoy. Not too hot today, so my daughter just held her on her lap. We didn't want to put her in the grass because we have so many red ants. She was inquisitive and somewhat active. Now she is back in her tank and standing on top of her basking rock. We left a new bowl of organic kale, dandelion leaves and orange pepper in her tank ... which she is ignoring.

I have called the 2 pet stores and all the "live bait" stores in my immediate area (we basically live on an island) and nobody has any suitable live food. So tonight after my son finishes homework we are making a 2-hour trek to go get small crickets, a probe thermometer, and new lighting if we can find it at Petland.

Question -- we probably won't get home until about 8pm. Can I feed her then, and put her to bed at 10pm after some basking time?

If she's still awake when you get home - sure

My schedules for my hatchlings were :
>> lights on (timer) 6am
>> my hatchlings' first feed of live insect (largest feed of three feeds per day) @ 10am
>> second feed of live insects was @ 2pm
>> last feed of live insects was @ 6-7pm (diner time) & I offered shredded greens and grated veg then. (IMO is best to give the salad to hatchlings later in the day than earlier).
>> lights out 10pm


>> Being retired we were able to manage 3 feeds = no1 is 45% + no2 is 35% + no3 is 20% + salad was my schedule of daily insect ration , if you are not a SAH mom , you might need to settle for 2 insect meals per day unless you are cunning and buy insects that can be left in a dish and wont scurry off and hide (silkworms , blowfly gents , BSF lavae are able to be left ( as the second of three meals).

I varied the feeders and feeding sizes
>> first feed included a couple insects given by hand ==> bonding
>> feed no1 and no2 = crickets (20-25day old ie 1/4 size)
>> feed no3 was small (1-1.5 inch) silkworms

>> if you can get BSF lavae ( Phoenix Worms ) these are great feeder insects for hatchlings.

>> I'd get enough crickets to last 2 weeks + a pot of BSF lavae & a box of mixed silkworms (1/2 inch - 1 inch long) and mulberry leaves or chow (comes in powder form in a bag (is easy to cook and make ready for the silkworms to eat it).

>> is OK to mix and match live feeders insects , even have different live insects for each of her three meal, a lot of small meals in her case are better than 2 or 3 larger meals , let her eat her fill each meal.

.



Also, I have some photos but I'm not sure how to upload to this post. Can someone advise?

Thanks again!!
94982-9440460619.jpg
94982-899762810.jpg
94982-9525650544.jpg
94982-2543365327.jpg

<<< getting nice little podge on her :)
94982-170884966.jpg
94982-7665541013.jpg

>>> I think she likes snuggles ...
 

newbeardiegma

Member
Original Poster
AHBD":3hth52tx said:
How is she doing ?
She is doing fantastic! We are finally getting in a groove ... have got the lighting and temps corrected and got rid of the red "night light" so she is sleeping better. She's ignoring her salad (mostly), which I've read is typical. She's not much of a hunter and prefers the Phoenix worms over crickets because they just sit in the dish wiggling. And I think she's finally starting to put a little weight on! I will see if I can snap a few updated pics and post them tomorrow. :) Thanks so much for checking up on her (us)!
 

Drache613

BD.org Sicko
Staff member
Moderator
Hello,

That is wonderful she has improved so much! :D
She will eventually start eating her greens & salad but it takes time. She probably wants
the food to come to her! LOL I'm happy she's gaining some weight, also that's terrific.

Tracie
 

newbeardiegma

Member
Original Poster
Just wanted to post some updated pictures. Aztec is doing very well after all the help and advice we received from this forum ... so thank you all again!!

She doesn't like to hunt, and if left to capture the food on her own, she eats very little. But if we hand feed her or drop the food in front of her face, she's eating fine. As you can see in the pictures (before picture on left, current picture on right) she's gained some weight. The pictures are 10 days apart.

Some quirks: She does not want to be fed or touched outside of her tank, but is fine with any interaction inside her tank. Once out, she is focused on exploring. And she does NOT like to be put back in. The only exception to this is at nighttime, when she loves to come out and snuggle in a blanket, where she promptly falls asleep!
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94982-9565952443.jpg
 

Drache613

BD.org Sicko
Staff member
Moderator
Hello,

She really looks a lot better & I can definitely tell she has gained some weight. :D
It sounds like she is getting spoiled if she likes her snuggles in her blankie now. I
love the name Aztec, very cute. She is loving being handfed also, so that will be
interesting weaning her off of that. LOL
OH of course, her first priority is to explore & run around out of her tank, that is
of utmost importance. LOL I would take that as a good sign that she is getting so
curious & is active, also!

Tracie
 
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