Bearded dragon hasn't eaten for a week.

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Fin

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Just finished giving her the meds and was just wondering how long till she will eat willingly again or have her appetite back?
 

EllenD

Gray-bearded Member
It can take a while. Something to remember is that reptiles recover from illnesses extremely slowly. Where it takes us a week to get over a bug, it takes them a month. And the meds are always a compounding issue with their appetites, which is why giving the probiotics to them before, during, and for at least a week after the meds is important. So continue the probiotics, and keep offering his normal food every day, both his live bugs and his fresh greens/veggies. He'll most likely start out slowly and continue to eat a little more each day, but he probably won't be back to normal for a week or two. I'd offer water on his snout at least twice a day until his appetite is back to normal, because since he gets most of his hydration from his food, he can become very dehydrated if he's not eating. You can even mix up slurries for him, including squash baby food, blended greens and veggies, even add a live insect or two into the blender...Also, be sure to add a pinch of his Calcium powder and a pinch of his multivitamin powder to the slurries, and you can add his Probiotic too, along with some unflavored Pedialyte for hydration. This way he'll get some nutrition, but also hydration, probiotics, and his daily supplements while his appetite is off. I'd offer the slurries twice a day, and still offer his regular foods, until his appetite is back to normal. The slurries will keep him from losing weight, becoming dehydrated, and keep his blood Calcium level up.
 

Fin

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Hi just wondering if this is a good thing (im pretty sure it is) my bearded dragon has gained 15g after one day without medication.
 

EllenD

Gray-bearded Member
Well it's certainly not a bad thing! Beardies can lose up to 25 grams with a single bowel movement, so sometimes people weigh their beardie and freak out because they lost 15 grams in two days, so they think something is wrong, when in reality it was just a bowel movement. It's when they CONSISTENTLY LOSE a few grams every day over weeks that there is an issue. So if most likely lost most of the weight he did not from the actual parasites or the meds, but just from not eating normally and a lack of fluids. So if he gained 15 grams overnight it's due to fluids and any food he's eaten, which is good, but the point is don't get worried or discouraged if you weigh him again tomorrow and he's lost 10 grams from today if he has a bowel movement. As long as he's not losing weight daily, steadily, or losing more than 25+ grams in a day then he's doing well. Hopefully you'll see a steady rise in his weight over the next month, as his appetite picks up little by little due to the parasites being eliminated and his gastrointestinal tract normalizing and feeling better.

Everything with their health happens very slowly, bit by bit over time, whether good or bad (but more so for the good when recovering). It's a marathon, not a sprint with them unfortunately, but your guy seems to be doing just great and definitely heading in the right direction. Now that he has finished taking the oral meds his appetite should pick up a little bit more each day, and within the next week or two he should be eating his normal amount of live insects and fresh greens, and that's when you should see weight gain happening that measures over the 25 gram mark. But again, as long as he's eating, he's not lethargic, his eyes and color are bright, he's not sleeping constantly or hiding away from his basking spot, or having diarrhea or vomiting, he's doing fine, and don't be at all surprised if you weigh him and he loses between 1 gram and up to 25 grams after having a bowel movement, that's perfectly normal for any dragon...
 

Fin

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She still hasn't got her appetite back, not even a little bit, no interest in food what so ever. I've been force feeding her dubia roaches for a few days now just to get some nutrients instead of probiotics and a slushie type food. Is it normally like this?
 

EllenD

Gray-bearded Member
Has she completely finished the meds now? It's possible she still has the parasites, if she has totally finished the meds I'd be getting a follow-up fecal test just to make sure they cleared. It's unfortunately not uncommon at all for them to need a second round of meds.

I forget, did we go over your UVB light and temps? I think they were fine, but I talk to a lot of people, so just want to make sure.
 

Fin

Member
Original Poster
Well the vets said to give it to them for 3 days in a row in low dosage which we did but we had some left and I read that you should give the medication 2 weeks after as the eggs hatch. Will be doing that in 3 days. Yeah their uvb is a newly put in 14% acardia uvb and temps are all good hot to cold.
 

EllenD

Gray-bearded Member
Okay, yeah, it's good to do the follow-up dose, sometimes it takes a while for everything to get flushed out of their system, it is a nasty condition for them to go through because of the havoc it wreaks on their gastrointestinal tracts, then eggs get left behind, then the meds are harsh. So it can take quite a while for things to get back to normal. I would finish the follow-up dosing and then I'd still make arrangements to at least drop off a fresh fecal sample for a follow-up fecal test, that's always good practice anyway. That way you'll know if he still needs more meds, or if he's clear then you'll know he just needs some time to get his stomach settled.

Something you can try is buying a container of Soy Yogurt, all Walmarts and most grocery stores sell Silk brand Soy Yogurt with the regular yogurt. I had a lot of luck boosting appetite after a course of meds by letting their lights on first thing in the morning for an hour or so, and then giving my guy as much of the Soy Yogurt as he would eat from an eyedropper or an oral syringe, they usually really like the fruit flavors like strawberry, raspberry, blueberry, etc. The Soy Yogurt not only provides live, active cultures (acidophilus), so he's getting more probiotics, but the more important thing it does is coat their stomach which is typically upset by the combo of the bugs and the meds, so they aren't hungry. I found that about an hour or two after feeding him the Soy Yogurt he would eat close to a normal amount of live insects, just because his tummy felt better. So it's something else to try. Make sure that any Soy Yogurt you buy him is dairy-free, I know all the Silk brand Soy Yogurt is completely dairy-free...

Something else that's always a possibility is that the meds caused a secondary yeast infection in his gastrointestinal tract, now you've been giving him probiotics the entire time he was taking the meds so I doubt it's yeast, but it's always a possibility. The meds are meant to kill off everything, and unfortunately they kill off most if not all of the good, healthy, normal bacteria throughout his gastrointestinal tract, and this good, healthy, normal bacteria is what keeps yeast (and other fungi) from growing inside their guts. The probiotics are meant to replace the healthy bacteria that is killed off, but it doesn't always work that way. I've seen several beardies with some type of infection or parasite that took courses of either antibiotics, antifungals, antiparasitics, or antiprotozoans, like yours did, and then yeast was found on the follow-up fecal test. So this is yet another reason I always suggest that people get a follow-up fecal test done a day or two after the meds are completely finished. This will tell you if he still has a high coccidia count, or possibly another parasite or worm, or a secondary fungal infection, and that this is what is keeping his appetite down and he needs another round of the appropriate medication.

Hopefully he's just wiped out and his tummy is still upset from the bug and the meds, and the probiotics/soy yogurt will help settle it. Trust me, this isn't unusual at all, I know that doesn't make you feel any better about him still not eating, but I'd be willing to bet that 80% or higher of new baby beardies come to their new homes with some type of parasitic infection or worm infestation, whether they come from a pet store like Petco or PetSmart, or they cost $300-$500 from a really reputable and well-known breeder. It just happens, it's the nature of baby animals being bred and housed together. Think about puppies, they all get dewormed 3 times before going to their new homes, and if they don't they soon will be because they ALL have worms hook worms, round worms, pin worms, etc. All of them. The only difference is that dogs are mammals like us, and they have "normal" speed metabolisms and very tough gastrointestinal tracts in comparison to reptiles, who have extremely slowly metabolisms where everything happens very slowly. Plus, eating live food can be a factor as well, especially insects. But this isn't abnormal at all, unfortunately.

If you can get him to eat the slurries from an oral syringe and want him to get some protein in him, I'd suggest using an electric blender and throwing some of the dubia into the slurries. It usually entices them to eat more of the slurries because it tastes like dubia guts (yuck!), and more importantly it's much less stressful on them (and you too) than force-feeding live bugs to them. That can really take its toll on them, baby beardies become very stressed very easily, and usually force-feeding live bugs is extremely hard on them, and the person doing it. So using a blender to blend up live bugs is usually very successful, also Repashy makes an awesome product called "Repashy Grubpie" that comes in a bottle and you mix into a slurry or paste and feed to them, It's a meal-replacement for reptiles who eat mainly live insects and is made out of mostly Phoenix Worms/BSFL, so it's essentially like them eating live BSFL. So if you can find "Repashy Grubpie" at a local pet shop I'd recommend it even over the Oxbow Critical Care or Oxbow Carnivore Care that vets use, because it has a higher protein content. The Oxbow Critical Care is the second thing I'd recommend trying if you can't find the Repashy Grubpie. I know that PetSmart usually has Repashy Grubpie, though I've never seen it at any Petco. I've also seen it at an independent pet shop near me that has a huge reptile and amphibian section, so if you have any pet shops like that near you that's where I'd start.

One more alternative for you to try (take your pick on which you like) to get more protein and substance in him rather than just veggies and baby food is to buy a bottle of high-quality bearded dragon meal pellets and blend them into the baby food/veggies/Pedialyte, etc. My beardies have always had one of two specific brand bearded dragon pellets available to them in their enclosures at all times, this is more for my peace of mind than anything, so they always have access to food if they want it. So I did a ton of research about which pellets are the most nutritious and which are total junk, and most are complete garbage (never ever buy any pellets or other food that contain freeze-dried or dead bugs, like dried crickets or mealworms, they are all garbage). But there are 2 brands of pellets that are actually provide as much protein as live insects do, as well as key vitamins and minerals. The best are the RepCal Pellets, they come in a bottle of multi-colored pellets (either small, juvenile pellets, which is what I always buy, or large, adult pellets, which are better for making slurries with) that smell like fruit. They are excellent nutrition for beardies, the problem is that most beardies won't eat them. My 3 guys all pick at them, but my 5 month old boy loves them just dry. The larger adult pellets would be better for mixing into a slurry, I do this occasionally for my 1 year and 2 month old rescue boy when he has impactions. You have to soak the pellets in either baby food or Pedialyte for about 15 minutes and let them absorb the liquid, then you can either put them in a blender or just mash them with the back of a spoon and mix them into the baby food. If just for a nutritional supplement or meal replacement, I'd empty a container of baby food, whatever flavor he likes, usually butternut squash, sweet potato, or banana into a microwave-safe container and then add some of the RepCal pellets. If using the small, juvenile pellets I add 2 tablespoons full of pellets. I let them soak in the baby food for 15-20 minutes, or until they are soft and can be mashed with a spoon. Then add a little unflavored Pedialyte or water to thin it, and microwave it for 1 minute. The pellets will mix better once warmed. Then do your best to mash the pellets up really well, and you'll get a very thick slurry with some substance. They usually eat a lot of the pellet slurries, and it's essentially the same nutrition as Oxbow Critical Care. Mazuri is the other brand of pellets that are equally nutritious, but their pellets come in a bag and are little brown pellets that smell like vitamins, and my beardies won't even go near them. So the RepCal fruity pellets are by far the best available, all the other pellets available like Zilla, Flukers, etc. are complete garbage, lacking the protein content, full of sugar, etc.

So just another method of getting some protein in him. Like I said, force-feeding live insects can be very stressful on him, and can often make their appetites worse. So these are some alternatives to just feeding slurries containing baby food and veggies.
 

AHBD

BD.org Sicko
Good advice about the slurries and probiotics. Funny thing about dragons, some will enjoy these supplemental meals while others don't. Hopefully your girl will willingly take them. And they all recuperate from illnesses/surgery at different pace. One dragon here a couple years ago was spayed, lots of eggs removed + a had huge belly incision + scar. She was eating the very next day. :) And their metabolism can really be quite fast , esp. when young, otherwise they'd never grow as fast as they do and produce as much waste as they do. Your girl has youth on her side at 12 months of age [ I think you said that was her age ] but there are other factors that affect recovery. Stress and her genetics will also play a factor.

BTW, have you tried other insects to entice her, like hornworms ? I hope she recovers quickly and gets back to health ASAP !
 

Fin

Member
Original Poster
Thanks for your help, sorry for late reply haven't checked this for a while. She still hasn't had any interest in food at all, I've force fed her live bugs and slurries and nothing seems to happen. Going to get a fecal test as soon as she poos now.
 

EllenD

Gray-bearded Member
Yes, I would take a fresh sample in ASAP at this point, as either she has reinfected herself or the first round of meds didn't work, or it's possible that her gastrointestinal system is still out of whack due to the medications. Has she lost any weight? Is she lethargic as well, or is the lack of appetite her only ongoing issue?

You may want to think about buying a powdered probiotic, either a reptile specific powdered probiotic, or a tablet probiotic that you can crush and then dust her live insects by just mixing a pinch of it in with her calcium or multivitamin. I'm hoping she didn't end up with a secondary yeast infection in her gastrointestinal tract caused by the medication, that's pretty common with some of these harsh medications. I use a Digestive Enzyme and Probiotic combo tablet for my beardies when they must take a medication or if my rescue beardie is having constipation is straining to poop, or if any of them are having sluggish appetite. I buy it at Walmart in the human vitamin aisle, the brand is "Spring Valley", which is the main vitamin, mineral, and herbal supplement brand that Walmart sells, green bottles with yellow labels and yellow caps. It's called something like "Digestive Enzyme with Probiotics", and it's a bottle of I think 200 tablets for around $6. It's amazing stuff. It contains around 10 naturally occurring digestive enzymes found within the gastrointestinal tract from the saliva to the stomach to the intestines, which help them better digest any food they do eat and makes food easier on their stomachs when they're not feeling well, and then it also contains the most common probiotics that will ease their stomachs and replace all the normal, healthy bacteria that the medications kill off, which is what allows the yeast to grow. So if they do have any secondary yeast infection caused by the medication they are on, this stuff replaces the normal, healthy bacteria throughout their gastrointestinal tracts and kills off the yeast. I just crush a tablet and add a pinch to the calcium powder I'm dusting their insects in. Works amazingly at amping up their appetites and normalizing their bowel movements.
 

Fin

Member
Original Poster
She hasn't lost any weight, its stayed at 493g this whole time. She is quite lethargic, sleeping quite a bit but is still alert sometimes, looking out at whats going on and moving about occasionally.
 

Fin

Member
Original Poster
Alright, I bought some wax worms just do get her appetite back up and its worked. She's gaining weight and looks more alert, however she has no interest in them at all after a few days of feeding them to her. So whats going on?
 
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