Coccidia /Albon not working

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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby hill202 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:04 am

traildrifterphalanx wrote:It can be very frustrating, but that's likely the new medicine messing with her gut. She's still willing to eat, even if she is eating less. I also would not fret the minor weight loss. A single poo can be grams worth.

I made a pledge to Richter, my male, that the day he declines a super worm, his favorite, favorite food, is the day I would be worried. While he was being medicated for coccidia, he turned his head and closed his eyes at a super. I cried.
I immediately ordered the reptiphilus that day, and the day after having some, he started accepting food again, but in the meanwhile he went days without eating as it shipped


From Bug de lite? I don't see it on there. I may be missing it though.
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby hill202 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:05 am

I see it now.
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby hill202 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:15 am

Those slide pictures above are the results of me moving the slide around and looking for the biggest "clump" of it. It is more widespread than I've been seeing but it also seemed to be an increase over yesterday. I realize that it's cyclic but the pattern as usually been it get's better and then progressively worse again, to the point that it is wall to wall on the slide. When it gets to that point, it really shows in her behavior.

Taking pictures with the phone worked better than I thought. Alot of that stuff is drifting and moving.
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby hill202 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:30 am

This is a professional image of pinworms and coccidia in the background.


[Click image to enlarge]
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby hill202 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:34 am

This a professional image of what is considered a very high coccidia count.

4 days ago, I had one much worse.

[Click image to enlarge]
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby traildrifterphalanx » Sat Aug 12, 2017 11:54 am

I'm glad you were able to find it!
Hopefully those meds can help. Without an experienced vet, kind of sucks to be handling it alone.
It's nice you were able to get photos. I'm curious to see what those with more experience with fecals say about your images.

Richter and Alucard send well wishes her way!
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby hill202 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 1:16 pm

Thanks.

She is acting sick. Hanging her head. It appears to be the same pattern as with the Albon.

Maybe this third dose today will knock it out.

The directions don't say what to do if it does not work.

Maybe it is outdated med.(remember the use by May 2014 in the directions)
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby hill202 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 1:27 pm

Her condition appears to be deteriorating. The wood she is on is new, not contaminated. I just put it in a little while ago so she can get to her light. I placed her up there. She did not climb.

[Click image to enlarge]
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby traildrifterphalanx » Sat Aug 12, 2017 3:12 pm

Poor little sweetheart :(
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby AHBD » Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:14 pm

Poor little one....Maybe quit the meds. for now and put her in the temp. home. The basking platform is pretty high + she can fall from there if she's disoriented.
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby kingofnobbys » Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:02 pm

hill202 wrote:Patience? I've been dealing with this since the first of June.

After 3 months , there is a very distinct pattern that has developed in fighting this. I don't want to be negative but we'll see what tomorrows fecal looks like.


I've treated rescued skinks with antibiotics for 6 months (was a wild skink who I rescued from a cat), 3 months is nothing and quite usual when reptile are sick ( very slow metabolisms ).

Most of those three months she was being treated by an incompetent vet who refused to prescribe anything other than Albon and no attempt was made (until last week) to sterilize her viv or to actually give her antiparasitic meds or to use an effective treatment regime ie
>> antiparasitic drug
>> antibiotic drug for secondary infections in the gut due to parasites attacking soft tissues in the gut
>> frequent sterilization of the viv.
and keep her warm 24/7 while sick to help boost her immune system.

Keep in mind the length of the parasite's life cycle (about 4 weeks per generation) and that the antiparasitic drug will be targeted at one or two stages of this parasite's life cycle and wont kill 100% of the parasite , so you must keep to the treatment schedule for maybe 2 or 3 life cycles and continue checking for the presence of the parasite in the floats.

She's likely zonked out as a consequence of the new meds (you are sure of the doseage , which I expect is likely based on body-mass of the sick animal, careful not to OD her with them).

I think it will be wise to put her in a very Spartan temporary tub for now where she don't need to climb to get to the basking spot or the uv.

I also think it's very unwise to stop the meds so soon and so abruptly .... this is what creates drug-resistance ( a lot of the parasites and bacteria have been exposed to the med and if you don't continue giving it they will adapt and become impossible to kill using these meds when you restart , as their offspring will have immunity or a much higher tolerance to the meds , result is the coccidia will become even harder to get rid off.
CBDs: Puff ( RIP 10Dec2015 (3.2 years old (aneurism)) ,Rex (RIP 16Mar2017 at 4.6 yrs old (unexplained death)) , both adopted at 6wks old..Toothless & Peppa : (5 wks old 19dec2015).
Eastern BT Skinks : George & Mildred (born Sept 2010).
Eastern Water Skinks : Lucky (wild juvenile), rescued from a cat.Taken by a SI and far too soon, 9mths with us. RIP 21Jul2010.Wriggles - (rescued injured), small lizard thought she was a big lizard, 7-8 yrs old, died in her sleep, RIP 2Feb2016.)
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby kingofnobbys » Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:14 pm

AHBD wrote:Poor little one....Maybe quit the meds.<<<< that's probably a very BAD idea ==> will only result in the coccidia becoming resistant to the current meds , akin to drug resistant bacteria ( commonly called superbugs ) and drug resistant strains of malaria this way

for now and put her in the temp. home. The basking platform is pretty high + she can fall from there if she's disoriented.


I think he needs to make sure he's giving the correct doseage , I've not seen the doseage information / guidance on the drugs he's using now, but this information should be either on the box , tube , bottle or available to printout on the drug maker's webpage.
CBDs: Puff ( RIP 10Dec2015 (3.2 years old (aneurism)) ,Rex (RIP 16Mar2017 at 4.6 yrs old (unexplained death)) , both adopted at 6wks old..Toothless & Peppa : (5 wks old 19dec2015).
Eastern BT Skinks : George & Mildred (born Sept 2010).
Eastern Water Skinks : Lucky (wild juvenile), rescued from a cat.Taken by a SI and far too soon, 9mths with us. RIP 21Jul2010.Wriggles - (rescued injured), small lizard thought she was a big lizard, 7-8 yrs old, died in her sleep, RIP 2Feb2016.)
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby Drache613 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:12 pm

Hello,

Can I help double check the dosage? What do you mean it stated use by May 2014, are you kidding
me? So it was an expired liquid?
That is absolutely not right, it could potentially make her ill instead of better. What is the strength of the solution & how much are you giving her?

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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby hill202 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:42 pm

The directions that were sent with the med stated best if used by May 2014. Look at the bottom of the page.

It is 2.5% Toltrazuril, based on her weight of 50 grams, I am giving her .04 ml, once every 24hrs for 3 days and then one more dose a week later.

[Click image to enlarge]
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Re: Coccidia /Albon not working

Postby hill202 » Sun Aug 13, 2017 12:32 am

I know it looks like effects from the med but I don't think it is. I'm pretty sure its the coccidia coming right back around again.

One thing is for sure, todays fecal will show if she is getting worse from the coocidia, if it is like the other times, it will be full of it.

Now I can take pics of it.
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