Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

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Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby IvoryWhite » Thu May 10, 2012 2:26 pm

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Last edited by IvoryWhite on Thu May 10, 2012 5:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby tf2185 » Thu May 10, 2012 3:41 pm

Ok so I'm not the most expert person on here but I'm going to ask a few question that I know the experts will ask anyways.

What are the temperatures in the tank and what are you measuring them with? suface hot, surface cool, and basking surface
How often do you dust with calcium powder and vitamin powder?
Are his eyes sunken in at all?
Pictures would be great.

It's possible that something has gotten into his eye (substrate). I'm just warning you many people are going to warn you about the substrate you are currently using. The reason is mainly the risk of impaction, but it can also harber bacteria. the only thing i can think of is flushing out the eyes, i just thought i could get you started in the right direction.

I also have a few suggestions that I'm sure many would agree with and could cause problems later on:
toss out the 75 watt red nighttime bulb. It isn't necessary to have a heat light on at night time. The light can actually disturb them while they are sleeping. if temperature drops below 65, i recommend buying a ceramic heat emitter. they provide the heat without the light.
I also noticed that you don't mentiona UVB light. If you do not have one, you need to get one ASAP. The UVB light is vital for a bearded dragon. the one that everyone on here recommends is the Reptisun 10.0 tube or the arcadia d3. don't buy coil ones because they can do more harm than good because the UVB output is much lower than what bearded dragons need and they have been known to cause eye problems.
And i would just like to mention that there really isn't a need for those expensive basking light, household bulbs do the same thing for a lot less. just figure out what wattage you need and your set.
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby dragonlover3 » Thu May 10, 2012 6:52 pm

Hi,
Can you post a photo of him? 25 gms at 9 inches seems skinny to me.
Exo Terra UVB bulbs are Reptiglo's...they are not for bearded dragons and are known to cause eye and health issues. It would be best to turn it off right now and keep it off. His eyes may improve without the Reptiglo. He will be ok without UVB for a short while til you can get either a Reptisun 10.0 florescent tube or an Arcadia D3 12% ASAP.

What do you measure temps with?
You need to know the temps for 3 areas in his tank. Temps for babies are:
Basking surface.....105* to no more than 110* ....your basking temp should be warmer for your baby, {it will help his digestion, nutrient absorption and immune system.}
Hot end.....about 90*
Cool end....78 to 82*

Your dragon needs dark to sleep properly so I'd ditch any colored bulbs you have, red, blue, or black.

:banghead: Never take advice from a pet shop employee! Most don't know the proper care and requirements for bearded dragons and will tell you most anything for a sale or will mimic the incorrect information they've been fed. :banghead:

Here's a bit of education! It's easily researched on-line and many dragon keepers are aware of this.

The world over the word DESERT is used in regards to the amount of rain fall, not to indicate the land is sand. 30% of Australia where dragons originally come from receives such low rainfall it is called a desert but that 30% of Australia is not sand. It's dry and arid but not all sandy. Bearded Dragons spend much time in trees, in scrub brush, in grasses, and on hard packed dry clay and rocks. You said..." After all they can SURVIVE in their own element, can't they??" ...So, yes they can! It is misinformation and lack of motivation from pet companies and pet shops alike when they recommend sand and other loose substrates. They didn't do their homework, like Bearded Dragon keepers should do. They continue to assume desert means sand. I see you indicated you wanted his environment look as natural as possible....it's not sand....and certainly not walnut shells!
Both can cause a multitude of problems from eye issues and infections to being inhaled and causing respiratory issues or infections, and with any loose substrate you risk your beardie getting impacted from accidently ingesting it. Loose substrates retain the liquid waste the scoopers can't remove, they harbor bacteria, worm & parasite eggs and can mold when it gets wet. Using any loose substrate is like making your beardie live in a cat litter box.
The recommended subs for dragons are paper towels, news paper, non-adhesive shelf liner, ceramic or slate tiles and some use reptile carpet. These subs are disposable or clean easily. The cleaner you can keep your dragon, the healthier he will be.

So, he has a couple of possible causes of his eye issues. If you can correct these husbandry issues you may see an improvement in his eyes or at least it can be ruled out.

Here's a link for a list of nutritious food for your dragon. Most here recommend and follow it. http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Nutrition.html

I'd not feed your 9 inch-25 gm dragon superworms. They need to be 16inches long when a kink in their intestines straightens out before they have superworms.
I hope any of this info helps. How are his eyes tonight?
Amanda
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby IvoryWhite » Fri May 11, 2012 4:47 am

dragonlover3 wrote:Hi,
Can you post a photo of him? 25 gms at 9 inches seems skinny to me.
Exo Terra UVB bulbs are Reptiglo's...they are not for bearded dragons and are known to cause eye and health issues. It would be best to turn it off right now and keep it off. His eyes may improve without the Reptiglo. He will be ok without UVB for a short while til you can get either a Reptisun 10.0 florescent tube or an Arcadia D3 12% ASAP.

What do you measure temps with?
You need to know the temps for 3 areas in his tank. Temps for babies are:
Basking surface.....105* to no more than 110* ....your basking temp should be warmer for your baby, {it will help his digestion, nutrient absorption and immune system.}
Hot end.....about 90*
Cool end....78 to 82*

Your dragon needs dark to sleep properly so I'd ditch any colored bulbs you have, red, blue, or black.

:banghead: Never take advice from a pet shop employee! Most don't know the proper care and requirements for bearded dragons and will tell you most anything for a sale or will mimic the incorrect information they've been fed. :banghead:

Here's a bit of education! It's easily researched on-line and many dragon keepers are aware of this.

The world over the word DESERT is used in regards to the amount of rain fall, not to indicate the land is sand. 30% of Australia where dragons originally come from receives such low rainfall it is called a desert but that 30% of Australia is not sand. It's dry and arid but not all sandy. Bearded Dragons spend much time in trees, in scrub brush, in grasses, and on hard packed dry clay and rocks. You said..." After all they can SURVIVE in their own element, can't they??" ...So, yes they can! It is misinformation and lack of motivation from pet companies and pet shops alike when they recommend sand and other loose substrates. They didn't do their homework, like Bearded Dragon keepers should do. They continue to assume desert means sand. I see you indicated you wanted his environment look as natural as possible....it's not sand....and certainly not walnut shells!
Both can cause a multitude of problems from eye issues and infections to being inhaled and causing respiratory issues or infections, and with any loose substrate you risk your beardie getting impacted from accidently ingesting it. Loose substrates retain the liquid waste the scoopers can't remove, they harbor bacteria, worm & parasite eggs and can mold when it gets wet. Using any loose substrate is like making your beardie live in a cat litter box.
The recommended subs for dragons are paper towels, news paper, non-adhesive shelf liner, ceramic or slate tiles and some use reptile carpet. These subs are disposable or clean easily. The cleaner you can keep your dragon, the healthier he will be.

So, he has a couple of possible causes of his eye issues. If you can correct these husbandry issues you may see an improvement in his eyes or at least it can be ruled out.

Here's a link for a list of nutritious food for your dragon. Most here recommend and follow it. http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Nutrition.html

I'd not feed your 9 inch-25 gm dragon superworms. They need to be 16inches long when a kink in their intestines straightens out before they have superworms.
I hope any of this info helps. How are his eyes tonight?
Amanda





I can just not detailed enough to see his eye... i will post some though....
i feel sick to my stomach that i just realized the bulb the associate picked does not give UVB!!!!!!!!!!! im ssoooo madd..
I have the exo terra 100 watt intense basking bulb....
I measure his temps with a dial thermometer so yes i know his temps may b slightly off i havent money to get a electric one right this moment.
And yes i will ditch the colored bulb...
Thank you so much for telling me this info as far as their "desert" environment. Makes plenty sense. This is the type of response i needed!
His eye is SLIGHTLY better this morning i think the Dark coloring has decreased a bit in size, yet he still closes it from time to time. He wont eat any crickets and i tried a meal worm as a sub JUST to get SOME type of food source. And all he ate was one. I understand my gf had a calciumlight which he seemed to like. Now that ive brought him home he wont eat, still active when hes out of his cage, but inside of it....He just sits. So hes actually running around on my floor currently. Loves being out lol. COuld the light she had have helped his appetite?? I really hope hes ok hes always been pretty active and happy.

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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby dragonlover3 » Fri May 11, 2012 6:41 am

Hi,
What a cutie! I just adore baby dragons....well I adore all dragons really :lol: .
The fact that he is active and runs around when outside of his tank but just sits when in his tank can indicate an issue within his tank. Of course they do have long periods of basking where they don't move much but he should have some activity in his tank.
As you're aware dial thermometers are inaccurate junk and can be as much as 20* off so he may be having some temp. issues too. It may be to hot or to cool which would certainly affect his activity level and appetite. You can get a digital probe thermometer from a Walmart for about $10-$12.
Since you indicate you just brought him home he could also be having some relocation stress which affects their appetite and activity. He needs a short period of adjustment to relocation which is normal for them.
In your original post you had typed "superworms" instead of meal worms.....big difference :lol:
Many here will tell you meal worms aren't good for your little guy because they have a lot of crunchy exoskeleton called chitin which can cause impaction. That is so true!
Here's a bit of education. More importantly, meal worms have a very poor phosphorus to calcium ratio. The primary issues are the lower protein level, higher fat and a horrible and appalling Calcium:Phosphorous ratios. The ideal Ca:P ration is 1:1.3. The reason we get so hung up on Ca:P ratios is that their body determines how much calcium it needs to absorb based on phosphorous levels in the blood. In meal worms, not only is there very little calcium available, but the body is tricked into thinking it doesn’t need the calcium by the gross imbalance of phosphorous. They are not good in any way but I was happy to read it was meal worms and not super worms you offered. When your dragon gets bigger super worms are fine. Crickets aren't the greatest either but are readily available and with calcium dusting they are acceptable feeders. The following are better choices. Repti-worms, called Pheonix worms or calci-worms, butter worms, Dubia roach nymph, {I have a Dubia roach colony and grow my own for my 4 dragons}, horn worms and silk worms. Wax worms are good for treats.
While on the calcium subject, are you using calcium and vitamins to dust his live food once daily? They need calcium to prevent Metabolic Bone Disease and seizures .
When your baby's appetite improves he should be allowed to consume all the feeders he wants in a 10 to 15 minute period 2 or 3 times a day. It's a lot of feeders daily. They are growing rapidly and need the nutrition.
One of those feeder meals a day should be dusted with calcium powder 5 days a week. the other 2 days a week 1 feeder meal a day should be dusted with vitamin powder. An easy to remember schedule is Monday thru Friday dust with calcium and Saturday and Sunday dust with vitamins. Dragons don't process all vitamins well so giving vits only twice a week is best.
Getting either of the right UVB bulbs and a good thermometer to accurately measure temps and correcting those husbandry issues should show improvement in his eyes, appetite and activity. With proper husbandry and good diet and supplements you can have a healthy happy dragon.
I think it's wonderful you want to learn what's best for your little guy {or girl}.
Amanda
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby IvoryWhite » Fri May 11, 2012 7:18 am

- Yeah when he basks of course theres not much motion lol, but he doesnt do alot of EXPLORING in his tank lately. But my mistakes make SO MUCH SENSE as to why he doesnt ill fix it up ASAP.
- Yes ive heard about the dials as well. Ive been waiting for some extra cash to buy one i saw for abt 30 dollars. Glad i know better now. Hopefully i can pick up one of the digital probes today as well.
- And as far as relocation, ill do my best to keep him home from now on...
- Yes! PLENTY of calcium dusted crickets and meal worms lol. as Far as multi-vitamins....no not yet. I'll pick up some today!
- And as far as his weight goes how does he look in the pics from your opinion?? At times he sucks in his body and looks skinny,but moinutes later he can let his body relax and stretch back out (Not necessarily puffing up) and looks pretty healthy. he had the healthiest little appetite when i got him!! And i just want to keep him healthy and happy. And ive had him 3 months but he was about 1 month when i got him maybe a tad more, he was the biggest in the tank AND he was bigger when i bought him than ANY other beardie ive seen in other stores. SO all together i would gues hes about 4 - 4 1/2 months. And i check him often the bulges under his body are becoming very visible so i assume he is a boy . (Hope Blaze isnt really a Bella lol)
Thank you so much for your attention concern and advice ITS GREAT to experience the care and concern i read about everyday here. Thanks again and let me know if theres anything else i can do to improve his well-being.
And heres a little picture of him as of now!

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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby twinmommy » Fri May 11, 2012 1:35 pm

At 4 months old my little girl was 75 grams and almost 11 inches and she seems on the small side!. Once you get all your lights, Uvb., temps., and feeders straightened out I bet he will have a growth spurt. How often has he been shedding?
Good luck!
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby IvoryWhite » Fri May 11, 2012 4:29 pm

Well I got him exactly February 24. So ive had him abt 3 months. Since i got him he has shed twice. Which i believe is pretty normal. He was abt 6 or 7 in when i got him. This very day he is 9 1/4in. long and i believe my weigh-in was incorrect ill have to take him to a vet to see for sure.
But i believe he will be okay... In fact i just left PetSmart a while ago and Blaze is soaking up the UVB rays as we type lol. I saw an IMMEDIATE improvement in his energy but moderate improvement in his appetite.Although.. For the first time in abt 2 or 3 weeks, he actually CHASED crickets, in total he had 3 dusted crickets and 2 meal worms today. Im not completely satisfied, i need to make sure the progress continues. Im gonna get my little guy back HEALTHY again...
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby dragonlover3 » Fri May 11, 2012 8:30 pm

Hi,
When you had posted he was 9 " and 25 gms, I was picturing an EXTREMELY thin dragon. :shock: I agree with you, your weight estimate may be off. :lol: He could stand to weigh a bit more but I think he looks great! I'll bet you'll see him start to act and grow better with the husbandry issues addressed. I'll be following him and we all love updates!....{ and more adorable photos please! :D }
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby IvoryWhite » Sat May 12, 2012 7:20 pm

GREAT NEWS! SO this morning i had to go to work a bit early. abt 9am. I gave Blaze a morning bath, (he had plenty water this morning!) i dried him off and put him in his tank for some UVB rays.. A cricket passes on his basking rock and he GRABS it lol. After that i had to leave and ive been gone quite some time now. COming home i walk up and see him attempting to sleep on his hammock, so i before i turn the lamps off i notice he shed his tail!! two days of UVB and im getting improvement in his energy and appetite. At the moment hes sleeping so i cant snap a pic but in the morning i will measure him and get some pics. Ill b posting soon! night
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby kcarello » Sat May 12, 2012 8:33 pm

So happy to hear that he is doing so much better. Now, will you please stop feeding the mealworms before you are on here again asking for help with an impacted dragon! Make sure the crickets you are feeding are no bigger than the space BETWEEN his eyes. What substrate are you using, if it is anything loose, please change it immediatly also. Paper towels, newspaper, retile carpet, tile. all acceptable. Sand, walnut shells...health problems!!!
Kelly, Mom to Puff, Deuce and Cheza
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby IvoryWhite » Mon May 14, 2012 8:28 am

If you look at the messages my dragon was NEVER impacted he just wasnt eating..... But thanks for the advice... Andi will change his substrate. Is Home Depot a good place to buy tile?
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Re: Something Is Wrong With My Beardie's Eye !

Postby IvoryWhite » Mon May 14, 2012 8:36 am

UPDATE!!!
5/14
I gave Blaze a morning bath today... Afterwards He had some WASHED and lightly dusted kale for breakfast... And he just devoured about 20-30 dusted crickets. He has his old appetite back, ate one after anotherlol. A sof now he is literally SOAKING up the UVB and UVA lights i have on him.... He seems to keep inching towards it lol which is great he is very responsive and even more active. His eye is SLOWLY getting better the dark spot is going down. But i will still find a vet near me to take him to get it checked out. other than that i have a happy dragon!!
I will continue to update... I know i said i would measure him and get pictures again but hes been making so much progress i want to let him be.. but i promise before the week is up ill d o it
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