New Beardie Help

Hi everyone! I got a beardie (Miss Thorn) for my library last February, and I am having issues with bonding. When she is on me, she almost cuddles into my neck, but when I reach into the cage, she freaks out. Today she ran into the glass side so hard I thought she was going to hurt herself. I guess I should count myself lucky that the only time she has bit me was last March, but I just feel awful about how panicked she gets. When I pick her up, I make sure to lift her by her belly and put her on my shoulder quickly, but she also started throwing her tail around and digs her nails into whatever skin she finds. She used to try to escape every so often from me holding her, but she seems to have slowed down thankfully. I hold her every day for at least an hour (oftentimes more) as suggested. I started walking around with her more to get her used to that, but I still feel like I am doing something wrong.

I've only ever had warm blooded animals before (birds, dogs, cats), so I am hoping I am just overreacting. I am just nervous that this behavior is permanent because how can I take her to school with me and have the kids interact with her if she is this jittery and frightened. Am I doing something wrong?? I don't want to hurt her either (physically or mentally) with going to school if this is just her personality. Or is there something I need to change or do? Any advice??

-Miss Thorn's Concerned Mom

How old is she? Are you approaching from above? Is she doing everything that a dragon does - eating basking pooping? Her lighting what are you using for a UVB coil or tube? How old is the bulb and where in the tank is it?
Karrie

KarrieRee":ay8ljz7i said:

How old is she? Are you approaching from above? Is she doing everything that a dragon does - eating basking pooping? Her lighting what are you using for a UVB coil or tube? How old is the bulb and where in the tank is it?
Karrie

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Miss Thorn is under a year (they approximated maybe three months back in February). I have to approach from above because when I try to approach from the side, she runs and glass surfs. I have tried and tried, but it only works if I move quickly. Yes, she is eating and pooping regularly. She hasn't really been basking as much as she used to though. UVB coil overhead light, and I bought it new at the end of last February. It sits right above her cool side of the tank.

If the coil is a 13 watt please get rid of it! They are inadequate -- she needs a 24" fixture w/ a reflector-- if she's in a 40 + gallon tank--- you need to do this ASAP-- at this point shes getting no UVB- you can try and hand feed her worms and salad is she eating salad? Basking temps what are they and how are you taking them? So sometimes it takes awhile to adjust - but she should be coming around - take a piece of clothing or fleece blanket something w/ your smell on it and put it in her hide- you need to have your hand in the tank as much as possible and start hand feeding her but you need to.get that UVB changed out ASAP-- I gave more info for you regarding feeding etc-- and websites to find a UVB fixture
Karrie

KarrieRee":2h7pho2h said:

If the coil is a 13 watt please get rid of it! They are inadequate -- she needs a 24" fixture w/ a reflector-- if she's in a 40 + gallon tank--- you need to do this ASAP-- at this point shes getting no UVB- you can try and hand feed her worms and salad is she eating salad? Basking temps what are they and how are you taking them? So sometimes it takes awhile to adjust - but she should be coming around - take a piece of clothing or fleece blanket something w/ your smell on it and put it in her hide- you need to have your hand in the tank as much as possible and start hand feeding her but you need to.get that UVB changed out ASAP-- I gave more info for you regarding feeding etc-- and websites to find a UVB fixture
Karrie

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I think you are right about the UVB. She is in a 20 gal tank because her 40 gal one is at work (this was only supposed to be temporary for weekends and holiday use). I am in the process of buying a house, so the plan was to get a huge tank for there (I had trouble carrying the 20gal upstairs). I might have to revise my plan though as I just found out that the close date was pushed.

The UVB was what came with the set up (Zoo Med Kit). I got a grant from Pets in the Classroom, so I assumed it would be okay. I brought home her long UVB light though, so I will put it up tomorrow and see how she does. Yes, she is given fresh veggies (Kale, cabbage, broccoli, collard greens) along with either crickets, dubia roaches, or worms as a protein. As for basking temps, the hot side of the tank has a thermometer that reads between 90-100 depending on the temperature within the apartment. It's about half way down, so it sits about even with her log. I had a higher perch, but she fell off of it a few times, and I was afraid she would get stuck when I wasn't around. I was trying to hand feed her superworms (she LOVES those), but I need to get more. Thanks for the advice!

The UVB you brought home is a what? Brand and bulb please -- they need to be certain distances from her ---- and the basking temps your taking how? Stick on? Digital probe? Babies need temps to be 105-110 basking --- it is hard to get temps correct in small tanks--- I had a 20 gallon long that I had a 75 watt for basking bulb and a T 8 that was set up like this
the UVB is the long fixture going width wise and the basking lamp was clamped on the end there was no screen on that end of the tank --
Please no more broccoli or cabbage -- here is a website for nutrition ignore the kale thing its a good staple feeder http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Nutrition.html
Get some BSFL they are a good staple feeder -- they do not need to be dusted and you can feed as many as you want order large they are small - you can hand feed her those -- super worms should only be used as lures to the salad bowl for now -- 1-3 ---
you can order from here www.dubiaroaches,com they are currently not shipping roaches low stock - the BSFL are also known as nutri grubs phoenix worms or calci worms --
www.symtonbsf.com
I can give more websites for silk worms if you like they are another great staple feeder
Karrie

The UVB is a 24 inch with a 10.0 UVB bulb. The thermometer is a stick on that hopefully you can see in the pic. She doesn't seem to spend a lot of time on the hot side though. I am trying to upload a pic below:


I don't give her broccoli often. It's one of the few things she seems to like, so I just give it to her once in awhile. BSFL - that's Black Soldier Fly Larvae? I have never heard of feeding them those before I googled that acronym. Since she is my first, I have been typically asking the local Pet Supplies Plus. Probably not the best plan, but not all websites are trustworthy.

She doesn't eat much when she is on my lap or if I try by hand. Superworms were the only thing I could guarantee she would go after. I don't give her them often though. Just as a way to help with the bonding. She doesn't eat fruit. I have offered her just about everything that I can think of, but nothing seems to interest her. I will stick with what is on the list from the website you sent me. Thank you for that. I have tried searching online using a site based search to make sure validity, but it's easier said than done lol.

If you could send me the websites for silkworms, I would appreciate it. I am a tad hesitant to order anything online from a site I am not familiar with. It would help to have a few suggestions. Thanks

That tank is too small and basking temps are not correct if your not getting them w/ a digital probe - if that tank is the 20 gallon the UVB is too strong for that size of a tank ---she needs more decor to sit on --- I would get her into a bigger tank --- here are some websites for you
https://www.petsmart.com/reptile/environmental-control-and-lighting/zoo-med-reptile-terrarium-digital-thermometer-14914.html?cgid=500202
www.dubiaroaches.com nice roaches currently not shipping low on stock they have nice worms tho I get all my roaches from them
www.reptilianarts.com nice silk worms and good roaches and super worms - currently out of stock on the silk worms - if you ever order from them I get bulk like 50 you will need to order food to feed daily and clean containers out daily
www.xyzreptiles.com out of Palemetto Bay FL - they are fast they ship Fed Ex and they send food w/ theirs I just got a order from them this week
www.mulberryfarms.com
www.joshsfrogs.com
www.reptilesupplyco.com/
www.hornworms.com they are slow w/ back up orders I have silk coming from them --
I would suggest getting rid of the loose substrate -- you can get some textured NON adhesive shelf liner from Home Depot its cheap and easy to clean I would get it in the 40 gallon tank -- she will need to go into something bigger than that -- we recommend a 75-120 gallon tank --
Karrie

I am working on the larger tank. Since I had to buy two of everything (one for school and one for home), I just need a little time to save more. I have my eye on a Carolina Custom Cage (48L by 18D by 24H) or a Zilla Front Enclosure 40 gal. I am leaning towards the Carolina, but it is a tad expensive.

Should I put the smaller UVB light back then? I think it is a 5.0 UVB, but is maybe half of the size of the 24 inch. The bulb is also not straight (spirals). Would that be better for her? I am going to the pet store later today, so I will grab a digital thermometer while I am there. I can grab a smaller bulb if need be. She had more in her cage, but she was knocking it over. Plus, she got stuck one time when she fell off of one of them and got pined between there and the glass. Kind of made me nervous to leave it in there. It didn't help that I had to keep removing it every time I fed her because the crickets would hide and bite her at night. But if I switch to the larvae or silk worms, I can add more to her cage.

A T 8 5.0 bulb would be better but it needs to be the long fixture and I dont think a T 8 will fit the 24" fixture you have --- you would need to buy another fixture that a T8 would fit - the Zilla slimline is sold at most petsmarts and you can get the Reptisun 10.0 bulb T 8 to put in -- the slim line bulb that comes w/ the tank is ok but the Reptisun is better
More tank for your money is this one
www.zenhabitats.com
www.apcages.com/
www.talkingserpents.com/
or look on FB marketplace or Craigslist -- look for a tank w/ front doors - also if you find one on these sites make sure the tank is sanitized real good before use w/ Zoo Med Wipe Out or F 10 its a vet disinfectant you can get it here https://www.ebay.com/itm/F10-SC-Disinfectant-100ml-Veterinary-Birds-Pet-Bird-Reptiles-Cage-Cleaner-Vet/152133531790?epid=1664725015&hash=item236bdd788e:g
this stuff is good to have on hand and keeps a long time
Karrie

Thank you for all of the advice. I went ahead ordered a new cage (48'' by 24'' by 24'') and got a smaller UVB (20'') that fits the old tank well. I am hoping this will help. I try to do the best I can with all of my animals, but it's difficult as I've never had a reptile and there's no one I can get advice from. I really appreciate your help. Thanks!!

Ok so that T 5 you have will go into your new tank very well-- the 20" needs to have no plastic cover over the bulb and it needs to be 6-8 inches from basking decor unobstructed- so take the screen off and sit the UVB width wise-- on one end if the tank is too long- get your basking decor under it along w/ the basking bulb on the same end using a clamp- make sure you have a digital probe thermometer to get her basking temps- start w/ a 75 watt- what bulb is in the fixture? The UVB fixture? If it's the 10.0 go w/ a 8-10 inches the 10.0 is going to be stronger than the 5.0
Karrie

You should see a difference in her behavior right away- she should start eating more and basking more- if you need more help please ask
Karrie

MissThornsMom":1wl4sits said:

Thank you for all of the advice. I went ahead ordered a new cage (48'' by 24'' by 24'') and got a smaller UVB (20'') that fits the old tank well. I am hoping this will help. I try to do the best I can with all of my animals, but it's difficult as I've never had a reptile and there's no one I can get advice from. I really appreciate your help. Thanks!!

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Well, you're in the right place for advice... this forum is tops for all your care questions. Just for kicks, I tried out one or two of the Facebook Bearded Dragon groups... and my, oh my, you're far better off sticking with THIS group! No drama, spot-on husbandry advice, good folks.

Don't beat yourself up about past mistakes with your beardie. We all start out somewhere, and Pets in the Classroom, while a fabulous grant providing group, is largely aimed at getting you to buy stuff for your "free" pet. Pet stores are not generally reliable places to get dragon keeping advice... or advice on pretty much any small pet, truthfully. I did my master's project on companion animals in a classroom setting, and after reviewing the provided care guide pamphlets from several chain stores, I was appalled... between the misinformation and the gaps in the information, it's a wonder any store-bought pet survives a year. Besides that, there are products - like that coil UV bulb - packaged in "starter kits" that are just not good for the animals they're intended for. Employees can be great sources of information, if they know and love the animal you're asking them about... but some are told to just parrot the employee version of the pamphlet to potential owners.

The fact is, though, you're here now... and that's GREAT, because the folks on this forum can help you find reliable online vendors, the solutions to your dragon problems, and any supplies you need. I don't think I could have made it through my dragon's first six months without this online clan! Welcome to the forum.