Baby Beardie about 2 months old concerned dad

OHBeardie07 · Jan 1, 2009

My baby is about 2 months old and she is pretty light in color. She does not move around much at all and she just sits around. Im concerned about her health and not sure of any good reptile vets in this area. If you could give me some advice that would be great. She also does not seem like she is growing as fast as her brother. Thanks

Mike

Pleaides · Jan 1, 2009

hey
ok i know this is gonna be a pain but could you answer the following questions so we could get a better idea?

how long have you had your beardie?
what size enclosure is she in?
is she housed with her brother at all?
if they are not housed together can they see each other?
what uv do you have? what brand? how old is it?
how far away can they get to their uvs?
what do you feed her? what live food exactly?
how many times a day do you feed her?
what are your temperatures?
what kind of thermometer are you using to measure their temperatures with?
does she eat greens at all?
do you dust her live food? if so what supplements are you using and what brands?

if shes just lighter in some areas than others she could be getting ready to shed and obviously all dragons will grow at different rates.
if you could answer the above questiosn we could help you out much more, if you could post a pic that will help even more?

how often are you supplementing their food with?

OHBeardie07 · Jan 1, 2009

Pleaides":98899 said:
hey
ok i know this is gonna be a pain but could you answer the following questions so we could get a better idea?

how long have you had your beardie? I have had her for almost a month now
what size enclosure is she in?She is in a small 10in x 20in terrarium
is she housed with her brother at all?She has been with her brother since birth... he is active quite a bit
if they are not housed together can they see each other?
what uv do you have? what brand? how old is it?Im not sure what the numbers on it is but is the 2 in 1 round light with the round UV and the halogen night bulb
how far away can they get to their uvs?the closest they can get is about a foot maybe farther
what do you feed her? what live food exactly? i feed them very small crickets
how many times a day do you feed her? i feed them atleast once a day if not twice
what are your temperatures?The temperatures are never under 80
what kind of thermometer are you using to measure their temperatures with?I use a digital thermometer
does she eat greens at all?i feed them romaine lettuce but they dont eat it very much but if i hand feed them the lettuce they will normally take a couple bites
do you dust her live food? if so what supplements are you using and what brands?I dust the crickets with herpcare cricket dust

if shes just lighter in some areas than others she could be getting ready to shed and obviously all dragons will grow at different rates.she is just light all over except where her dark details are
if you could answer the above questiosn we could help you out much more, if you could post a pic that will help even more?

how often are you supplementing their food with?i dust the crickets every feeding

here is a picture she is on top its not a great picture but you can kind of see the difference in color between her and her brother.

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30057715&id=1434060056

K9KidsLove · Jan 1, 2009

OHBeardie07":17a66 said:
Pleaides":17a66 said:

what size enclosure is she in?She is in a small 10in x 20in terrarium
***It is almost impossible to get the temps right in a tank that small. Look in your newspaper ads for a bigger tank. As an adult she will need at least a 40 gallon breeder tank, which is wider than a regular 40 gal...18" instead of 13" and at least 48" long. I suggest purchasing the 40 gal breeder & put a divider in it til they get big enough to need their own big separate tanks...about 5-6 months.

is she housed with her brother at all?She has been with her brother since birth... he is active quite a bit
***You don't want to house them together. They will breed too young and you don't want brother to be breeding sister. Also, one will become dominant & not let the other eat enough. You may have to put something between their tanks so they can't see each other.

what uv do you have? what brand? how old is it?Im not sure what the numbers on it is but is the 2 in 1 round light with the round UV and the halogen night bulb
***It is really important that you look on the bulb to see what the brand and # is. Some of them are bad for dragons.

how far away can they get to their uvs?the closest they can get is about a foot maybe farther
***this depends on which bulb you have

what do you feed her? what live food exactly? i feed them very small crickets
***How many are they eating? Are their crickets smaller than the space between your dragon's eyes?

how many times a day do you feed her? i feed them at least once a day if not twice
***You should feed them at least twice a day & 3 if you can. Their tiny tummies can't hold much at a time, so need to be fed more often...just like human babies & puppy babies.

what are your temperatures?The temperatures are never under 80
***The basking end should be 95-105 and the cool end should be 75-82. If it is cooler than 65 at night, use a ceramic heat emitter. As I said, it is nearly impossible to get & keep the temps correct in such a small tank.

what kind of thermometer are you using to measure their temperatures with?I use a digital thermometer
***Does the digital thermometer have a probe at the end of a wire? Are you leaving the probe on the basking spot 45 minutes to get a correct reading?

does she eat greens at all?i feed them romaine lettuce but they dont eat it very much but if i hand feed them the lettuce they will normally take a couple bites
***Romaine has no nutritional value. It is mostly water. They need collard, dandelion, mustard, or turnip greens. They can also have squashes...summer, zucchini, butternut (this needs peeling...looks like a huge pale yellow pear). This being said, many babies don't eat much of their veggies, but offer a small amount daily & hope yours take to them while they are still young.

do you dust her live food? if so what supplements are you using and what brands?I dust the crickets with herpcare cricket dust
how often are you supplementing their food with?i dust the crickets every feeding

Click to expand...

***dust only once a day with RepCal(pink label) without phosphorous, with D3 for 5 days a week & dust with ReptiVite (blue label)vitamins once a day for 2 days a week

***It is possible she is shedding. You need to soak them daily for 20 minutes in warm water to their armpits. They might not like it at first but it is a necessity in order to keep them from getting dehydrated.

Keep us informed.
Good luck
Patsy

OHBeardie07 · Jan 2, 2009

Ok here is an update... The UV light is RZilla 120v 23w. the thermometer does have a probe on it. I have my 7 or 8 month beardie in a 40 gallon breeder tank. but i have his old tank that is 30in long and 12 in wide. would that be better for the two now? and then just put something down the middle of it? the temperature reading with the probe on the rock under the heat light is about 84 not good i know... how do i get that temperature up? The babies are taking a bath now... is it really bad if brother and sister breed down the road? or are they always going to be seperated?

K9KidsLove · Jan 2, 2009

Hi...You can raise the temp by putting a higher wattage household bulb in place of the one you are now using. Make sure it is right beside the UVB bulb. You need the temp to be 95-110 and 75-82 on the cool end.

You need to replace your UVB with a ReptiSun 10 long fluorescent tube.
Go to: http://www.petmountain/product/bulb...-bulb.html It is about $20. You will see a big difference with the correct bulb. It needs replacing every 6-7 months. He needs to be 6"-8" from the UVB.

Keep him in the larger tank. And yes, they will always need to be kept separated. For now, put the smaller one in the smaller tank til you can afford to get another 40 gal breeder with its correct set up.

Are you leaving the probe on the basking spot 45 minutes to get a correct reading? If it is still too low, raise his basking spot. I put bricks under my basking logs to get the temp right.

If you make these changes you will see a big difference.
Good luck
Patsy

Pleaides · Jan 3, 2009

hello
ok i agree with patsy
you really need a reptisun 10.0, the long tube bulb and in conjunction with that a white light, household bulb will do fine.
yep they will need seperating i never ever recommend keeping beardies together unless for breeding purposes, i would not breed her anything before the age of 2 or at a certain weight more so.
dust the crix with calcium at least 5-6 times per week and dust with multi-vit at least 2-3 times per week.
hope your little ones do better.
keep us updated.

Ethelia · Jan 3, 2009

Hi there,
To be honest it sounds like your little girl is just getting dominated in her viv.

The general belief on this matter is that beardies are solitary and territorial creatures and so should always be housed alone.
It drives us crazy that pet stores and local breeders often insist on it being fine.

Males + females especially shouldnt be housed together because they can overbreed.

Furthermore when beardies are housed together one usually becomes dominant causing the other beardie to not grow properly due to stress, which sounds exactly like what has happened here.
I cannot tell you the amount of times we have read about one beardie not eating well, we advise the owner to seperate and then within a week we get replies saying how much better their dragon is doing.

Also beardies can and do attack eachother, unfortunatly dragons are not like dogs, who can be taught about naughty aggressive behaviour. They can live in apparent harmony for months and then one day snap. Once it has happened once, it will happen again and again.
Dragons will think nothing of nipping off a chunk or tail/toe in order to defend their basking spot, its just in their nature.

I dont mean to scare or scold you, but I want you to appriciate what can happen:
In my time keeping dragons I have rescued two dragons who were living in a viv with other dragons.
Dexter was small for her age and was missing a bit of her tail, most of her right arm, most of her right foot and alot of her toes.

Ruben had his leg and arms ripped off at the joints by his clutchmates.

There are rare cases where dragons show no signs of agression towards eachother, and there isnt too much bullying but it is a risk that is simply not worth taking.

I would suggest you separate your beardies with a cardboard screen for now until you can figure out a perminant solution.
Your dragons will lead much happier healthier lives apart.

Holly

OHBeardie07 · Jan 4, 2009

I have some calcium dust for the crickets its reptocal and it does have 6% phosphorus in it. is that going to work or do i need to get something without it? and as far as heat i saw that the heat bulbs at the store are pretty expensive so will a normal house energy saving bulb emit enough heat?

beardie parents · Jan 4, 2009

phosophorus free calcium is best as they get to much phosophorus in their feeders.

diamc · Jan 4, 2009

Hi, you were given some great info and I agree with the others that the larger one should be in the 30 gallon and the sickly one in the 20 gallon. By looking at the picture, she does not look good, her eyes look very unhappy, she looks like she might be dehydrated and she looks very thin. Since she is not moving around much at all, it proves that she isn't getting what she needs, probably from being dominated by her larger brother. When you see 2 beardies sitting on top or laying on top of each other, there are domination issues going on as they are each fighting for that particular area, usually the basking spot

Most of us here use Rep-Cal brand calcium and vitamins which you can get very cheaply here and if you order before midnight tomorrow, you can get 10% off your order by typing HOLIDAY in the box on the checkout page. http://www.petmountain.com/product/vitamins-supplements/105551/rep-cal-ultrafine-calcium-with-vitamin-d3.html

You can use a standard household lightbulb, not the energy saving coil household bulbs as they don't put out enough heat. When I used a 20 gallon for a baby, I used a 60 watt in the summer and a 75 watt in the winter but you'll have to see what the basking and cool side temps are with the probe laying right on the basking spot then on the cool spot after waiting about 45 min for the temp to stop rising. Room temp makes a big difference on the bulb wattage you'll need to get the correct temps. What wattage basking bulb have you been using?

Since babies can get dehydrated very quickly, it would be a good idea to bathe them separately at least 3 to 4 times a wk in a transparent contain or even a sink. Be sure to put a washcloth down on the bottom to give them something to hang on to & to keep them from sliding around. Test the water temp by the inside of your wrist, should feel warm but not hot. Add enough water to cover their front legs but watch them very closely as they can drown very quickly. A 15 to 20 min soak will properly hydrate them.

OHBeardie07 · Jan 4, 2009

Thanks everyone for your help with my baby stella! She and I will greatly apreciate it. I have been on pet mountain trying to figure out the new terrarium for them and i got the light fixtures out im just trying to find the right bulbs now. Im using a regular house bulb for the heat light for all three tanks and then not sure which night light to use from them. If anyone has any recommendations for a night light that would be great. Keep in mind i live in Ohio so this time of year my house is never warmer than 70 degrees so the night light will need a little heat. Thanks everyone I really appreciate all the help!

Pleaides · Jan 5, 2009

hey unless your temps are dropping below 65f i wouldnt worry too much, however i like to keep mine at 70f so i use a ceramic heat emitter, it gives off heat but no light whatsoever so you dont need to worry about keeping your beardies awake.
im in the uk so not sure if its different there but i had to buy 4 seperate things for my one, the bulb itself, the fitting for it and the cable because it gets hot you need the fitting and cable to be heat resistant and obviously id always recommend a guard surrounding the bulb as i know my boy likes to cilmb and sometimes he will cling on to the guard, obviously the guard isnt right up near the bulb so it doesnt get too hot for him to burn himself.
hope this helps

OHBeardie07 · Jan 10, 2009

ok another question its been a week maybe and baby stella is still pretty light and not active at all. she dosnt seem to eat much at all and is noticably smaller than her brother... im a lil worried but i dont wanna be worried if i dont have to be. You guys have been great help so i thought i would come back to you!

Pleaides · Jan 11, 2009

ok when they shed they can be light in colour for what seems like weeks
could you perhaps post a pic so we could get a better look?

Baby Beardie about 2 months old concerned dad

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