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Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:06 am
by PixiePaula
Hi all,

My 11 month old bearded dragon is very sick. He has been diagnosed with MBD and given liquid Vit D by the vet but has not improved. He had a black beard most of the time and moves very little as he falls upside down easily. He hasnt eaten for nearly 2 weeks. Our female hasnt eaten for over 1 week either and we do not know why.

He was housed with a female of the same age, but we have since invested in his very own separate setup another 4ft viv. Uvb has always been T8 10% Reptisun. Basking 40C Cool end 30C. we don't know why he developed MBD in the first place as the vet told us the setup is correct, but he always seemed much weeker than Olive. They are fed on crickets or roaches dusted with calcium and spring greens, peppers, squash. Occasionally wax worms as a treat. However they slowly stopped eating all toegther. And peaches health has declined rapidly. He doesn't like me to force feed him but I have done a few times mostly mixed veggies with the syringe. He spits most back out. The vitD liquid i give him dailey. He looks very miserable and is very twitchy. He has spasms on his legs and stomach. Please could anyone give me some advice as the vet didn't even seem that concerned when he was diagnosed and said he would improve and get better. However the fact that both are not eating for so long worries me a lot. He also opens his mouth a lot and seems more agressive than usual as i suspect he's in pain.

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:14 am
by KarrieRee
Please post pics of the tank and the dragons--- how old is the T 8? I was thinking that one was dominant over the tank that is usually what happens- taking over the UVB and basking area but w/ them both sick now I am now I am not sure- Tracie our vet mod is going to haft help you-- where is the T 8? On top of screen or inside the tank?
Karrie

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:46 am
by PixiePaula
Hi Thank you very much for your reply!
These are some images with Peaches and his Viv. The one without him in is Olives tank which is where he was housed together with her most of his life. She was more dominant than him, however she is much smaller and actually very small for her age which is why we weren't initially worried with the female being the more dominant one. She is not aggressive at all but she has been closer to the UVB than him so it may be that. We separated them as we wanted to rule out stress as being the main cause and because Peaches was falling over constantly and needs a more simple enclosure.

I am at home mostly all day and spend a lot of time with them so I have been monitoring their behaviour since we got them. I take them out frequently to rest on my shoulder and I wonder if that may have impacted his UVB. But whatever happened the damage has been done and he is very poorly. I placed him on top of the house for a few hours to get closer to the UV and my partners step dad is currently building him a raised platform with a ramp. I dont think he can currently climb the ramp as he is too weak but I am trying everything I can.

What do you think I can do, as I am so worried. With Olive I wonder if it is more down to stress as she seems mostly healthy on the outside but I have not included pictures of her.

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Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 12:07 pm
by KarrieRee
Ok the UVB has no reflector correct? That would be the issues w/ the dragons--- both are lacking uvb - calcium- my recommendation is to get a reflector on that bulb ASAP or get a fixture w/ a reflector-- or take the UVB and place directly over them 4-6 inches-- I am assuming the other tanks UVB does not have a reflector either-- I would get both of them outside if it's summer where you are sit w/ them on you outside in direct sunlight for 30 minutes per day till you get your lighting fixed- you need to keep them hydrated and I would start feeding them slurries of fresh veggies like collards turnips mustard or kale w/ some squash or argula a little fruit and calcium powder in it - the mvd would be cause of calcium deficiency
I can post a link for reflectors if you need it- how old is the UVB? If it's a T 8 they need to be replaced every 6 months
Karrie

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 12:34 pm
by PixiePaula
Hi Thank you Karrie,

In all my research I have honestly never heard about these reflectors, so that is very interesting that you raised that. Please do post me a link that would be great! Thank you. The new set up is brand new, I invested in all new lights, the whole thing. The old Viv lights were all replaced at the beginning of March so I guess we will have to change those fairly soon. I have them out whenever its hot. I don't know if you are also in the UK but some days its very hot followed by a few days of cold winds and rain ect We are having quite drastic changes in weather lately. So I definitely will continue to do that. Do you recommend to continue trying with the syringe feeding? I am making smoothies of mixed veg but they are quite reluctant.

Thank you so very much.

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:11 pm
by KarrieRee
No I am in the US --we have had more people on here w/ issues w/ their dragons w/ NO reflectors - they are being built in the UK w/ no reflectors on these fixtures - the reflector intensifies the UVB rays and directs it downward toward them -- w/ no reflector and on back walls the dragons are basically getting no UVB -- so w/ that being said here is the link for a reflector
https://www.reptiles.swelluk.com/arcadi ... eflectors/
Yes please keep feeding him slowly and small amounts 3 times per day and feed slowly so he does not aspirate -- I would give him like 1 ML at a time - especially since he has not eaten in 3 weeks - we want to build his strength back up but you must get him out into the sun for some good UVB -- I recommend you get a Arcadia bulb 12% w/ the D3 -- they are basically a Reptisun T 5 here in the states are considered the best on the market at this time - I currently use the Arcadia bulbs - but they are in fixtures w/ reflectors - when getting the reflector put on your fixture I would get it so its 6-8 inches from the dragon and not shining in the dragons eyes thus why it is best to hang them overhead -- please keep us posted w/ the behavior of the dragon after you get him out in the sun -- I know the weather here has been goofy as well - we have had a week of gorgeous weather where its in the mid 70's and no humidity and then a week of where its in the 90's and humid as h***-
Karrie

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:31 am
by PixiePaula
Peaches passed away sadly a day or two after this conversation. We don't understand why.. as i doubt it was MBD alone he was under a year old and had a very good setup. We placed him close to the uv light when he was unable to move. He got much worse and struggled to breath he was in a LOT of pain so it breaks my heart. I have no idea why it became fatal. He was gasping for air and then died before we could get the emergency vet appointment. Heart broken..

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 4:50 am
by KarrieRee
:cry:
I am so sorry to hear ---
Karrie

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 8:56 am
by WinFam01
Aw, I am so sorry.
It does sound like there may have been something more than mbd going on.
How is your other dragon doing?

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 10:27 am
by PixiePaula
Thank you for your reply:) The vet suspected he may have had a kidney disease which led to organ failure. He was always much weaker then Olive so it may have been genetic. Bless him..so sad.

She seems to be doing well despite not eating any solids. We are feeding her vegetable and cricket smoothies. When she ever decides to do a poo..we are getting her fecal tested for parasites as that's the only thing I can think that could stop her eating. Maybe Peaches also had a parasite and he was too weak to get through it. So I want to make sure. She doesn't seem especially stressed just does not want to eat at all.

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 10:31 am
by KarrieRee
Make sure you have a reflector on the UVB --- and depending on the bulb T 5 or a T 8 distance plays a role in it ---- they will not eat if they are not getting UVB --
Karrie

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2020 10:44 am
by PixiePaula
Thanks we have ordered one:) She sits very close to the UV lamp on a raised back log. She had been eating really well until 3 weeks ago when Peaches got sick. Thank you so much for your help.

Re: Very sick beardie with MBD hasn't eaten for 2 weeks

PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:20 pm
by WinFam01
Thanks for the update. I hope that Peaches starts eating again soon.