Switching from albon and pyrantel to toltrazuril and panacur

I posted in health but really need to know if I can dose my beardie today. Below is the post I posted. Please respond asap.


Ok so I'm somewhat experienced with beardies but not really with sick ones. These two I got a couple months ago have been fighting every parasite they can get. I'm working on having them tested for aradenovirus but until I get that test trying to lower the coccidia and pinworm counts. The albon and pyrantel the vet has been prescribing doesn't seem to be doing anything and she isn't very familiar with beardies so i took it into my own hands to research and just received my shipment of toltrazuril. Slate (my smaller beardie) he hasn't taken the albon or pyrantel in over a week so I know hes fine but granite started showing serious signs if infection that she hadn't shown before She's always gained weight and is literally 3 times his size and they were the same size when I got them. So i tried to hold off for the new meds to get here when she tested pos for coccidia amd pinworms because we've done several fecals and she's been treated for pinworms, flagellated protozoa, and a bacterial infection but never saw coccidia. Well her stools stayed runny so did another fecal that showed coccidia and pinworms. But she stopped eating for 2 days so i have in and gave her the first 3 doses of albon. My question is, how long should i wait to give her toltrazuril? Or can i go ahead and switch her?

Hi there, how has she been acting since being on the Albon ? If she's doing well you might just go ahead and give her a dose of toltrazuril tomorrow. It usually works in 2-3 doses and it's not very harsh.

BTW, were the dragons lethargic + not eating well before you gave them the meds. ? You mentioned 1 dragon is much smaller. Also, are they in separate tanks ?

They are in separate cages both 40 gallon breeders with mercury vapor light and basking spots around 103. The smaller, slate, acted sick from the beginning he had stopped eating and never grew. I took them both for well check ups and that's when we found all of the parasites and infections. They were sent to me in the same container and were the same size when I got them, actually my bigger one now, granite, was the smaller of the two. I've been fighting flagallates and bacterial infection with the and coccidia with him the entire time but she never showed coccidia but always had runny smelly stools. Ut this time the vet found coccidia. She's always had a healthy appetite until this week. I was trying to wait for the meds but she stopped eating. I had to give her jump start one day, then the next she ate 4 crickets, she usually eats 30-40 crickets in the morn 30 dubia whilenim at work and another 20-30 crickets when I get home. So I decided it was best to go ahead and give her the reptaid and albon until I could get her meds. I have had the hardest time and spent hundreds trying to get these guys well and it just seems like I get one thing cleared and the vet says she finds something else. So I did my research. After the 2 doses of albon she's picked up on her appetite a little but it hasn't been very effective in getting the counts down much at all with slate so I'd rather treat then both with the toltrazuril and panacur. In hoping i have better results.

Have they been medicated with other meds. in all this time, if so what were they ? And can you post pics of both of them in their tanks, including lights ? Here's how to post pics :

https://www.beardeddragon.org/useruploads/ Then use the XIMG to upload them

If this works these are of slate. The smaller one. I took down his fountain and just use the bottom as a water bowl, they both seem to enjoy soaking in them especially when they are shedding. I still bathe and spray them but I kept the top as a asking area for him. His cage is due for cleaning so ignore the mess, but I'm taking her pics now.

These are granite. U can see the size difference and when I got the she was actually a little smaller. She always grown really well. She started out around 60 grams at her first vet visit about a month ago and she's 216 grams now. Skate started at 12 grams which is how I knew something was really wrong but since treatments he is now 71 grams. But he still has large amounts of coccidia in his still and now she is also showing coccidia. The vet thinks she had it from the beginning and just wasn't shedding them at that time. She still looks healthy, she's mad right now because I woke her up for pics, but yesterday and today she's a little more active than she was the last few days. Hes been more active and eating better but he doesn't wat as much as her, he rarely eats crickets, every once in a while I can get him to chase a few but he prefers dubia roaches. I give him a small dish every morn and night and he eats about 30 small in the morn and 20-30 at night, but they both eat veggies. I give them a mix of collards carrot top cilantro, a bunch of different greens but only the ones safe to feed all the time and a variety of squashes and veggies and sometimes some mango.

Aw, you didn't have to wake them, pics could have waited until tomorrow. They both look good so that's a plus. Not skinny or anything. Does Slate bask a lot ? BTW, keep an eye on the fake plants, I learned long ago that my beardies tried to eat them and I never could use them even though it makes the tank look nicer.

They both bask quite a bit. They only get down to chase food or eat veggies, well, that I see anyway. I work a lot so I'm not here to watch their every move. Slate usually moves up the vines away from the direct light throughout the day and granite will go to the bottom hammock or to the other side of hers also. Hes only basking now because he was asleep already by the time I got home so I woke him up and warmed him up so I could give him his meds and fed him his bowl of dubia. He sleeps a LOT. he always has. It's not quite as bad now but hes still usually asleep by 5pm and sometimes 2pm. If I have to work early and I get them up at 4am hes sleeping by the time I get home at 2pm. So, sometimes I like to get him up to warm up and eat. Just so I know hes getting what he needs. With granite she still looks healthy but she lost about 10 grams over the few days she wouldn't really eat. She's gained back about 5 but I can still tell she's smaller. She's always been huge. They were tiny babies when I got the around mid April so the parent more than 2-3 months old but she has always been big and healthy. That's why when she stopped eating I knew I had to give her something for the coccidia until I got the toltrazuril. so yeah, now I'm just hoping these meds work better than the meds from the vet cuz vet costs are killing me.

Yeah he shouldn't be sleeping so much. What type of MVB do you have ? Of course Granite is fine so I imagine the bulbs are good ones.

They are noth flukers bulbs his is a 150 I think and he's is 100. His is a little bigger than hers because she started in a smaller tank but when I moved her she seemed to be fine with it still. I think the coccidia is why he sleeps so much. It was really bad when I realized something was really wrong. I almost lost him. He was so tiny the cat didn't even know how to treat him, she had to research everything so of course I research also to make sure what she did was safe. But every new stool we check still shows coccidia. Granite had a bacterial infection first we treated with and antibiotic that was injected, I gave her a shot every day for 10 days, the her next stool showed flagallates, or flagellates protozoa, or the vet said would be what we would call guardia, we treated her with metronidazole for that, then this next stool showed pinworms and coccidia. I'm just want these guys healthy. I'm going to send in a fecal to this online lab I found to test them for adenovirus.

So how long was the little guy been on meds. ? The reason I ask is because that can take a real hard toll on their health. The little guy especially should have a beak from the meds. if he's been on them for 3-4 weeks. And BTW, Tracie [ Drache613 ] is one of the mods. here and works directly with the lab that tests for ADV. Send her a p.m., she can have the test done for a very low price.

I'll have to check that out and see what she says. I haven't given him any meds for a couple weeks just because hes been eating and I didn't like giving him the same med for so long that didn't seem to be working. So I stopped his meds week before last. She's never been on meds for coccidia but was on one antibiotic for 10 days with about a week break then 3 days of metronidazole 10 days no meds the 3 more doses and she's been off the for about 2 weeks. I just gave her the pyrantel and albon mon for the first dose and only dose of pyrantel but she had the albon tues and wed.

Yeah, definitely keep him off the meds. since he's eating. Beardies can tolerate certain levels of parasites pretty well but over medicating can weaken their immune system terribly and kill off the good gut flora [ bacteria ] along with the bad.

BTW, the Fluker's MVB is not a highly rated one, next time [ or soon ] you might want to go with the Megaray. It's supposedly the best one out there.

I will hold off on his meds. And yes, ibplan in changing them out very soon. Thanks!

Hello,

Since they are eating, basking & gaining weight right now, I agree that holding off on more
meds would be a good idea. They should hopefully be able to fight off the levels naturally
if they are healthy.
The tanks look good also. If you need help with adeno testing, you can sign up on my adeno
site & I work in combination with the Research Associates Lab, in Allen, TX.


Tracie