New baby keeps eyes closed - other factors too

My son just got a baby red beardie a few days ago. He's about 8" nose to tail. Currently he's in a 10 gallon tank (we'll get a larger one ASAP). He'd been doing fine, as far as I can tell, eating freeze dried crickets and kale.

We got a "All Living Things" brand beardie/tortoise kit "desert UV" and 75w basking bulb. He's been under that for about 2-3 days now. Basking side of the tank is around 95-100, and the other side is about 85. He can climb a log to get closer to the lights.

Two days ago, his tail shedded, and it looks like his feet are next and he has a little flake of skin on top of his head.

This morning, my son accidentally dropped one of the lights on him but quickly picked it up. He thought he was dead and he didn't move for about a minute, but then he came around. Now he's walking around and seems fairly normal, but he's had his eyes closed all day and he sits with his head up in the air. He hasn't eaten today. He'll crawl around on the stuff in his tank and he crawls up our shirts if we hold him. He did have a good poop today.

Now we're doing research on forums but it's so frustrating with all the conflicting information. We've seen a lot of mentions of coil bulbs being bad for their eyes.

We're worried and my son feels terrible. Any advice? I told him we'd go out tonight and get a reptisun 10.0 tube, which seems to be highly recommended here.

Thank you SO MUCH for this wonderful resource!

Babies need live food, small crickets. 3 feedings a day. As many as they can eat in 10 minutes. There’s a lot of good info on this site, a lot of great members who can give you advice on what to get. He will need a 40 gallon home in no time. It’s very hard to regulate the temperatures with a 10-20 gallon tank. I hope you did not buy the kit with sand. The sand is no good for them to be on. Use non adhesive shelf liner or tile or even paper towels for now. Please upgrade him to a bigger tank. He also needs a probe thermometer to make sure his basking temperatures are not too hot. I believe 105 is perfect for the little ones. They need it for food digestion. Enjoy your baby now & get some good pictures, they grow fast. He sounds beautiful.

Here is a good list of veggies & fruit to try.
http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Nutrition.html

Thanks for the reply. We'll get some live crickets too.

We don't have sand - it's a green carpet/astroturf type thing.

We got live crickets and a Reptisun tube. We put 4 crickets in with him and he hasn't reacted at all. They've actually walked on him and he doesn't move - just sits with his eyes closed and head pointed a bit upward. If we pick him up, he crawls all over our hands and up our arms, but in the tank, he just sits still.

I'm beginning to be afraid he's blind. Perhaps from the light falling on him?

Lights are off for the night now, so I'll see how he is in the morning I guess.

Hi. He more than likely has relocation stress. Give him a week or so to get comfortable.

How long has the hatchling gone without food so far ?

Temperatures
… at the basking spot ?
… in the warm zone ?
… in the cool zone ?

How are you measuring these temperatures and exactly what are you using to do these measurements ?

I ask as it's likely you are using a dial style thermometer that often comes in these hopeless petshop kits and so there are two potential issues here

>> possible issue 1) the thermometer is very inaccurate and reading much lower than it should ==> you think it's 90 to 100F in the warm zone but actually maybe 110-120 or higher …. this will eventually kill the hatchlings as it will loose it's abilities to move to thermoregulate and to feed.

>> possible issue 2) the thermometer is very inaccurate and reading much higher than it should ==> you think it's 90 to 100F in the warm zone but actually maybe 60 to 70F or lower …. this will eventually the hatchling being very chilled and having very low metabolic rate and becoming very sleepy and lethargic.

Is crucial you check these temperatures using an ACCURATE THERMOMETER.
These are good : https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Aquarium-LCD-Electronic-Digital-Thermometer-Fish-Tank-Water-Detector-Practica-IT/163132247831?rt=nc&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D52946%26meid%3Df8197cd09ab343abadc660a13e68ac32%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D252762165947%26itm%3D163132247831&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851

This will give you more information : viewtopic.php?f=5&t=233516

This will help you work out this problem out methodically : viewtopic.php?f=6&t=236150&p=1815390#p1815390

UV adequacy : A VERY STRONG UV SOURCE IS NOT OPTIONAL .
Regarding the UV source

Is it rated 10%UVB ?
Is it in a reflector hood ?
How far from the basking spot ?
Is it under or ontop a mesh lid ?
How long is it and the basking globe on each day (photoperiod) ?

Guide for temperature and UV gradients and setup viewtopic.php?f=34&t=235611

Feeding :
dried insects are NOT REMOTELY ADEQUATE for a hatchling.

ONLY GOOD CHOICES ARE :
Blowfly gents
Housefly gents
Blacksoldier fly lavae
the above are very high in Ca and very soft and slow moving but need to be left in a worm excape proof feeding dish (and separated from the substrate they arrive in) and are perfect for leaving in a dish all day for the hatchling to eat at it's leisure while you are not home.

silkworms
also slow moving and very soft , and also safe to leave in a dish (on a mulberry leaf or some silkworm chow and also very nutritious and high in Ca (mulberry leaf has a Ca/P about 10 which is very good).
With silkworms , the ROThumb of no longer than the space between the hatchling's eyes doesn't apply, a 15g hatchling can easily handle a 1" - 1.5" long silkworm and will eat 6 - 8 of these in sitting ….and will think YUMM !!!

crickets
locusts
roaches.
these are fast movers and best fed by hand or only given 2 or 3 at a time so you and the hatchling are not overwhelmed and can keep track of the insects which will scurry off / hop in all directions.
Give a few , let the hatchling eat them, repeat, and repeat again until hatchling looses interest.


Your hatchling must be fed LIVE HIGH QUALITY FEEDER INSECTS AT LEAST TWICE PER DAY ( THREE TIMES PER DAY IS BETTER (but can be hard to do if you are not home all day everyday unless you use your smarts in your choices of feeders).
As many insects per feeding session as it wants - NO RESTRICTIONS - when it's full it will loose interest.

Pin heads are too small (lots of people thing small hatchlings can only eat pinhead crickets ).... I'd offering uping the crickets to 20 day old (1/4 size (?))

Expect him to catch and eat maybe 6 - 8 per feed , 2 to 3 per day. Only at most 2 crickets given at a time , let him eat them , then give another couple , repeat til he looses interest (is full) …. will more easily keep track of these fast moving insects this way.
I'd be feeding him in his tank , less stressful for him this way.

Blowfly and Housefly gents are likely going to appetising along with medium sized white very active BSFL , the flies were a hit with all my baby skinks and hatchlings too (I'd leave pupae in a little lid and they were eating them as they emerged , and even leaping to catch them in mid flight.

scale in cm.

Small silkworms are an excellent staple feeder too

18mm

33mm
these are about 1 inch - 1.5 inch long which is perfect for small hatchling (3 or 4 are a good feed).
Photos of the setup and the dragon will help.

Thanks for the info! I will post pictures tonight when I get home.

He seems to be doing better today. Eyes open more, and he's climbing around. He did eat two small crickets and had a big poop. I know he needs more crickets than that, but it's a start.

We got a 18" T8 Reptisun 10.0 bulb and have it in a fixture with a reflector, sitting on top of a mesh cover on the tank.

sledzeppelin":red00qnf said:

Thanks for the info! I will post pictures tonight when I get home.

He seems to be doing better today. Eyes open more, and he's climbing around. He did eat two small crickets and had a big poop. I know he needs more crickets than that, but it's a start. <<< that's a good sign . It's perfectly ok to handfeed a hatchling some of it's insects I did this for all my baby skinks , rescued skinks , and hatchling dragons - as a daily bonding ritual .
I did first 2 or 3 crickets per day given by hand while they were being restrained on my chest , then when they got the hang of it restraint was no longer required (they often opened their mouths when they saw and smelt the bug and took it without my need to coax them or gently force them.

I've continued this practice for all my pet lizards all their lives , only one who seems to prefer to eat her own bugs most the time is Fluffy the rescued water skink, but even she doesn't mind taking a mealworm lavae or pupa from my fingers occasionally..

Here is a thread that shows how : viewtopic.php?f=18&t=235583


.
We got a 18" T8 Reptisun 10.0 bulb and have it in a fixture with a reflector, sitting on top of a mesh cover on the tank.

Click to expand...

T8 UV tubes are quite weak cf T5HO tubes and only suitable for shallow tanks about 12" tall at most.

That tube needs to be mounted UNDER THE MESH (cable ties pushed through the mesh and forming 2 loops will easily support a reflector hood).
To get enough UVB , about 200 microW UVB / sq.cm at the basking spot it will need to NO MORE THAN 6" from the tube to the basking spot.

Update:

He hasn't eaten since Monday. Last poop yesterday. We've been offering greens, crickets, and waxworms, and he just keeps his eyes closed and ignores them. He climbs around some, but mostly stays still with his head pointed upward and his eyes closed. When we pick him up he'll climb right into our hands and doesn't want to get off of them. Has water dish, and we spritz him and the walls.

He's definitely about to shed on his head and legs. He's getting really skinny though.

His aquarium (10 gallon) now has: T8 Reptisun 24" tube mounted under the mesh lid, 75w spot basking light over a rock. Warm side is about 100, cool side is 86.