Hunger strike, but full of energy

Murkey · Feb 8, 2017

Hi all,
I think it might be time for a trip to the vets, but I'm having a little trouble finding a reptile specialist in my area, and you guys have given great advice before so here goes...

My little guy Vlad is refusing to eat any dinners, about two weeks ago his appetite was diminished but in the past week hes only eaten around four bugs (locusts) and no veg (though hes fussy about that normally). Thing is, hes running around the place all the time, and looks happy and healthy, though is noticeably getting skinnier (fortunately he was a chubby little punk before this).

He went through brumation from October to early Jan and didn't lose any real weight then, and spent the next two weeks being his normal greedy self, which suggests to me (along with his energy), that it isn't parasites. I've ordered a faecal test to be sent to me anyway, though as hes not eating hes not really pooping, so that might be problematic (he was pooping normally until a little while after he stopped eating)

His running around seems excessive tbh, and I'm thinking that it is a sign of stress. He seems unhappy to be kept in his house, glass surfing etc, but is happy to be held and REALLY seems to enjoy sitting by the window.

Additionally:
He basically lives in here (https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Pet-Supplies/Vivexotic-Viva-Bearded-Dragon-Starter-Kit-Oak/B009IPS0MS/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1486571020&sr=8-4)
His temps are normal.
He is one year and three months old.
I only assume he is a guy.
I recently changed his UVB bulbs (in fact, around the time this started, but i think that's a coincidence)

If nothing else, I guess I'm asking if its worth taking him to a 'normal' local vet, if there is anything useful that they can actually do, and when I should properly freak out, if not already.
Thanks for reading!

AHBD · Feb 8, 2017

Hi there, if you're not positive Vlad is a male, post some pics with the tail arched high in the air [ like a happy dog's tail ] while he's sitting on a flat surface , or in your hand. Post a full body shot as well to show his condition. Here's how to post pics :
https://www.beardeddragon.org/useruploads/ Then use the XIMG to attach pics

I don't think he needs a vet, it may just be that spring fever is causing him/her to be looking for a mate and most young dragons are energetic this time of year, or after brumation.

You do want to be sure about his temps, if it's too ht [ those enclosed vivs can be ] then he may be looking for a better place to hang out. What wattage bulb do you use and what uvb do you use ? How do you keep him hydrated ?

Murkey · Feb 9, 2017

Cool, I wasn't sure if I was being a really cruel master by not trying to help sooner, but if it isn't massively abnormal to eat so little in two weeks then I'll just keep an eye on him for a bit and see if he gets better. I had heard that they can be a bit weird during spring/after brumation, but him being my first little monster meant I didn't entirely know what to expect.
I'm using the exoterra Reptiglo 2.0 and 10.0 30 watt bulbs, which seem to be standard in pet shops in my area, and I keep him hydrated with weekly baths and trying to keep his veg wet (which he won't eat). He doesn't seem massively interested in drinking, I read they get moisture from bugs and through their vents, but do you think I should get a pipet or mist him?
I rechecked his temps and they are a little on the cold side (95f in his basking spot, 70ish on the cool side) so I'll work on that.
I'll try to get some pics in a bit, thanks for your help though!

AHBD · Feb 9, 2017

I have seen 1-2 other posters from the U.K with the same viv.

It probably works well if the dragon spends enough time on the basking platforms where they have access to the uvb. The 10.0 tube is fine, the 2.0 is really just extra light and won't offer much useful uvb.

For hydration you might spray him 1-2 X a week. If he drinks during a soak that's fine and you can soak him once a week but they actually don't absorb water through their back end.

And yes, you might pump the temps. up just a few degrees in all areas of the tank. Hopefully he'll quit worrying you soon.

I'll be looking for his glamour shots here soon.

Wendygk · Apr 15, 2017

I've had the same problem with my Attila for the past 3 weeks and just saw your story when searching for "hunger strike". We've had the added fun of him attacking his reflection in the glass. Never bothered him until now! Totally not interested in food - supers, wax worms, phoenix worm, dubias, and now I have a container full of silkworms. He has begrudgingly eaten 2-3 silkworms over the past week (finally). He's been so crazy I've had to tape paper inside his viv so he can't see his reflection!
At 9 months old, it appears we are dealing with a bad case of puberty :shock:
I hope he gets over it soon and gets back to eating like a monster - I miss my hungry dragon! Hope yours gets his appetite back soon too

kingofnobbys · Apr 16, 2017

Wendygk":wxnnmzfo said:
I've had the same problem with my Attila for the past 3 weeks and just saw your story when searching for "hunger strike". We've had the added fun of him attacking his reflection in the glass. Never bothered him until now! Totally not interested in food - supers, wax worms, phoenix worm, dubias, and now I have a container full of silkworms. He has begrudgingly eaten 2-3 silkworms over the past week (finally). He's been so crazy I've had to tape paper inside his viv so he can't see his reflection!
At 9 months old, it appears we are dealing with a bad case of puberty :shock:
I hope he gets over it soon and gets back to eating like a monster - I miss my hungry dragon! Hope yours gets his appetite back soon too

Take him out and tell him you are the boss , and hand feed the bugs to him (even if means gently prying open his mouth enough to slip the part of each bug into the mouth).

You could try covering any internal reflective surfaces that are it his (?) eyelevel (to remove the "ghost beardie" who he (?) thinks is challenging him (?).

My Toothless went on a hunger strike for about month while I was in hospital - he was missing and pining for his daddy and principle carer/feeder. Soon as I returned home he was back to normal and feeding great (for me).

You should take the opportunity to check his set up.

Double check the following

... TEMPERATURES ?
........daytime warm zone
........overnight
........basking spot
........ TOO COLD = SLEEPY DRAGON

... UVA AND UVB ADEQUATE ?
........is the uv rated AT LEAST 10%UVB ?
........COMPACT & WATTAGE ? , T8 ? , T5 ? OR MVB ?
........is it covered ? == BAD
........is it sitting ontop a mesh top ? == BAD
........how far from basking spot ? too far and the UVA and UVB WILL BE TOO DILUTE.
........ UVA FLUX TOO LOW where dragon is = lethargic dragon w/ a very poor apetite just in the short term , and neurological problems if this persists , not to mention MVB if UVB flux too long long enough with inadequate metabolisation of dietary calcium or inadequate intake out calcium

... SUBSTRATE ?
........is it sand ? == BAD AND IF CALCISAND EXTREMELY BAD/LETHAL
........is it particulate ? == BAD

... SHARING TANK ? == BAD

... TOO SHORT A PHOTOPERIOD (lights are not kept on long enough each day , will make beardie think it is winter , recommend at least 14 HRS PER DAY)

... FEEDING SCHEDULE ( recommend at least 2 hrs lights/heat on before first live feed and after last feed of the day)

... What season is it (there where you live).... beardies younger than 1 yr should not be allowed to brumate

Wendygk · Apr 25, 2017

Thanks for the info kingofnobby. Here's what I've got:

double check the following

... TEMPERATURES (in degrees)
89-99 daytime warm zone
67- 74 overnight
99 - 112 basking spot

... UVA AND UVB ADEQUATE ?
Arcata 12% T5 (6 months old)
........is it covered ? == NO
........is it sitting ontop a mesh top ? == NO
........how far from basking spot ? Approx 16-1/2" to substrate 12-1/2" to basking INSIDE screen top

... SUBSTRATE ?
Porcelain tiles and paper towel

... SHARING TANK ? == NO - unless you consider his stuffed animal lizard sharing :lol:

Viv is an ExoTerra 36x18x18" - could it be he's grown too big for it? He's about 17" head to tail.

... TOO SHORT A PHOTOPERIOD = lights on 13 hrs a day

... FEEDING SCHEDULE 2-3 hrs after lights come on and try to feed 4 hrs before they go off
... What season is it (there where you live).... it's Spring here.

He has eaten a little the past few days - a dubia or two, but still not interested in his greens. I even bought some processed dragon food that is supposed to stimulate his appetite. Wants nothing to do with it. He kept trying to climb to the top of the paper I taped inside the tank so he could see his reflection, so I finally took it off one end yesterday and he's back to "attacking" his reflection. Besides being VERY active and not interested in food, he seems fine. He's drinking plenty from a dropper when I offer it once a day. Pooping about every 3-5 days and poop is normal with good hydration and white urate. Had fecal done about 5 weeks ago and came back negative.

At 8 months old, we've started taking him outside with a harness and he's very inquisitive and getting more adventurous each time. Guy at the reptile shop told me not to worry about whats going on - its the season. I worry anyway! I hate to do a vet trip if not necessary - they tend to find all sorts of tests to run that add up $$$. I will if I have to, but he seems healthy besides the appetite issues.

Any advice or similar experience and suggestions appreciated!

kingofnobbys · Apr 25, 2017

Wendygk":3v70s441 said:
Thanks for the info kingofnobby. Here's what I've got:

double check the following

... TEMPERATURES (in degrees)
89-99 daytime warm zone
67- 74 overnight
99 - 112 basking spot

... UVA AND UVB ADEQUATE ?
Arcata 12% T5 (6 months old) <<<< is there a reflector behind the tube ?
it might be he's not getting enough UVA to stimulate his apetite at 16.5 - 12.5 inches from a naked 12% T5 tube. Insufficient UVA can depress their appetite.
see http://www.uvguide.co.uk/fluorescenttubereflectortests.htm , it can seen a good polished metal reflector will effectively double the UVA and UVB flux the lizard "sees".

........is it covered ? == NO
........is it sitting ontop a mesh top ? == NO
........how far from basking spot ? Approx 16-1/2" to substrate 12-1/2" to basking INSIDE screen top

... SUBSTRATE ?
Porcelain tiles and paper towel

... SHARING TANK ? == NO - unless you consider his stuffed animal lizard sharing :lol:

Viv is an ExoTerra 36x18x18" - could it be he's grown too big for it? He's about 17" head to tail. <<<< I'd be thinking of building him a nice big 4ft x 2ft x 18in to 2ft (tall) timber forever home as he'll appreciate the extra space and elbow room.

... TOO SHORT A PHOTOPERIOD = lights on 13 hrs a day <<<< bit on the short side IMO, can you bump that up by 2 to 3 hours ?

... FEEDING SCHEDULE 2-3 hrs after lights come on and try to feed 4 hrs before they go off
... What season is it (there where you live).... it's Spring here.

He has eaten a little the past few days - a dubia or two, but still not interested in his greens. I even bought some processed dragon food that is supposed to stimulate his appetite. Wants nothing to do with it. He kept trying to climb to the top of the paper I taped inside the tank so he could see his reflection, so I finally took it off one end yesterday and he's back to "attacking" his reflection. Besides being VERY active and not interested in food, he seems fine. He's drinking plenty from a dropper when I offer it once a day. Pooping about every 3-5 days and poop is normal with good hydration and white urate. Had fecal done about 5 weeks ago and came back negative.

<<<<< he's probably a bit hormonal and being a bit grumpy , typical teenage boy , he's got sex on his mind I expect .... are you letting him have fun time inside in a beardie proof area of the house .... I''d be bet he gets up to mischief and even does socially inappropriate things to objects he finds on the floor " and takes a fancy too " like shoes, socks, people's feet, cushions, soft lizard shaped toys, carpet ridges .... Our Puff was a devil in his first and second spring ....

At 8 months old, we've started taking him outside with a harness and he's very inquisitive and getting more adventurous each time. Guy at the reptile shop told me not to worry about whats going on - its the season. I worry anyway! I hate to do a vet trip if not necessary - they tend to find all sorts of tests to run that add up $$$. I will if I have to, but he seems healthy besides the appetite issues.

<<<< He might have gotten bored with his usual insects , you could try him on locasts or crickets or silkworms (he's big enough to enjoy a meal of 2 or 3 full sized silkworms and most lizards go nuts for silkworms ....once they've had one , they can't get enough and simply hoover them down as soon as they have them put in front of them).

Any advice or similar experience and suggestions appreciated!

Taterbug · Apr 26, 2017

Start tracking his weight with a gram scale. It's really really easy to misjudge weight gain/loss and this will give you data to work from. A 10% loss in a short amount of time is cause for worry and to see a vet. Otherwise it may just be his preference. Pepper's appetite dropped very quickly at about 7-9 months and he's been the same since but still healthy and active at going on 4.

Please don't resort to assist feeding a healthy dragon. This is unnecessary and will cause stress and possibly make the problem worse. Reptiles can be masters of efficiency and if they have other things in their mind they don't -need- to eat like mammals do. Keep up with the husbandry suggestions to limit stress and consider a bigger cage (as a general upgrade probably not food related).

Hunger strike, but full of energy

Murkey

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