Brand-new beardie and owner

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tigerlily

Hatchling Member
I just got my first beardie earlier this evening, and am housing him in a temporary 20 gallon enclosure with fine sand as substrate. I'm a little concerned because I've had the tank set up with the under tank heater and the basking lamp for an hour now, and the cage temperature is only up to about 80 degrees on the hot side. Will he be okay? I feel guilty for doing this to him, but the stores are closed now so I can't go out and get another lamp for him.
 

Bianca

Juvie Member
Hello and welcome :wave:
Can you raise his basking spot so that it is closer to the light? They need at least 100 degrees, can you build it up?The under tank heater will not do much, as beardies can only sense heat from above.
If it's evening, though, he will probably go to sleep soon and won't need a basking light overnight. Hopefully tomorrow morning you can get a different bulb or raise his basking spot so he can get warmer. If he's a baby, he will need bettwen 105-115 on his basking rock/log to have proper digestion and appetite. How are you measuring your temps?
 

tigerlily

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
I can probably raise his basking spot up by adding more sand to the cage. I'm measuring the temps with a stick on the side thermometer.

I'm using a 75 watt bulb that was recommended to me by the reptile specialist at the pet store. I'm starting to think I should've gotten a 100 watt bulb instead.

I was hoping that it just needed time for the heat to build, but its been two hours and the heat has only gone up a couple degrees.
 

Bianca

Juvie Member
What kind of sand do you have in there? If your dragon is a baby, sand is not recommended, especially the Calci Sand as it can cause impaction when they swallow it. Paper towels, shelf liner, newspapers are much better and easier to clean.
By raising the basking spot I meant maybe stacking more rocks/bricks/slates on top of one another or getting a log that he could climb closer to the light.
The stick on the side thermometer is not accurate. They can be 20 degrees off sometimes. You need a digital thermometer with a probe, you can find them at Walmart.

As a side note, I would not listen to the advice that the guys at the pet store give, they are known for giving poor advice and bad info. Just ask on here, there are a lot of helpful people who have had beardies for a long time and can answer almost any question :)

Could you tell me a bit more about your setup? What kind of sand? What kind of UV light? What are you feeding him? Did you get supplements? he will need his food to be dusted with Calcium (5 times/week) and vitamins (1-2 times/week). Most people on here use the RepCal calcium with D3 and the RepCal herptivite for vitamins.

How is your little guy doing today?
 

tigerlily

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
I feel awful. I did some cursory research on beardies and didn't see anything about sand or calci-sand being bad for them -- everything I read prior to going to the pet shop recommended sand so the beardie could dig. Later on today I'll stop by the petshop and get some reptile carpet and more rocks or bricks to raise his basking spot. The sand I'm using right now is called Repti-sand by ZooMed and the package reads:

"All natural substrate for desert dwelling reptiles. Pure, very fine quartz desert sand--better than silica sand stimulates natural digging and burrowing behavior. Natural colors. No added dyes or chemicals."

As for the lamp itself, I just got a Repti Spot basking light by ZooMed that provides UVA light. I know I'll need to get UVB light too, but they didn't have any hoods that would fit over the 20 gallon tank that I bought.

I have some of the generic staple diet for beardies that I soaked in water and put in a dish for him with some meal worms that I coated with Repti Cal calcium powder and the vitamin powder too.

Here's a silly question -- how do you separate the meal worms from the packing stuff easily? I sat there picking at it for about 10 minutes last night and only came out with 10 meal worms.

I'll see if I can find a digital thermometer tonight when I go to pick up some crickets. How long do you need to let them gut-load before you can feed them to your beardie, btw?

As for how he's doing this morning, my boyfriend says he was hanging out in the water dish when he got up and all the meal worms I put in his dish are gone. He was on his basking spot. He seems to be breathing easily, but I'm still concerned about the temperature in the terrarium. Even though the stick-on thermometers are inaccurate I'm pretty sure it's too cool because my hand doesn't feel any warmer when I remove the dish to put food in it. One of my coworkers suggested I put aluminum foil around 3 sides of the tank to help keep the heat in. do you think that will help?
 

Ozzy's Mom

Juvie Member
Bianca gave you some good advice.

Don't feel bad about the sand. Almost all pet stores give out bad or wrong informations. We're just glad you found this forum. The care sheets are good, but the people here are great!

I would not use any sand or particulate substrate for a baby. It is way too easy for them to ingest it while eating or just tasting stuff. IMO the best substrate is tile, slate, or non adhesive shelf liner (about $7 at Walmart...get the kind w/o the holes) due to the ease in cleaning it. You can also use newspaper, paper towels, reptile carpet, or nothing.

Once your dragon is an adult, if you really want to use sand, you can get washed and sifted sand at ToysRus for about $5.

I wouldn't spend the money on a hood if I was you, in just a couple months your little one will be too big for a 20gallon and then you'll be spending more money. I'd buy one of the cheap screen covers for the top and either set the fixture on the top of the screen or rig a way to hang it inside.

When you go shopping for UVB lights you will need a reptisun 8.0 or 10.0 (the bigger the number the better). Or you can go with a mercury vapor bulb (mvb) if you like. Beardies should be able to get within 6" of the UVB. MVB, on the other hand, should be about 12" from your baby.

Mealworms......also recommended by your pet store?

They are not really a good idea. They have a lower nutritional value than other live feeders and have a hard shell that is had to digest. Once your beardie gets 15" or larger, you can feed supers if you like.

Your best choices for feeders are crickets, silkworms, phoenix worms, or roaches. I personally don't really like crickets, but can't stand roaches, and can't get the worms w/o ordering online. Maybe I'll get some for Ozzy as a treat, but he does love his crickets.

If you feed crickets, you should give him as many as he wants in a 15 minute feeding. You'll want to feed "pinhead" size. Never feed your beardie anything bigger than the space between his eyes to reduce his risk of impaction.

Never leave crickets in with your beardie after feeding (at any age). If they get hungry, they will chew on your beardie and leave nasty sores....as shown in one of the care sheets on this site:

image032.jpg


Sometimes it's easiest to feed your beardie in a separate container so the crickets don't hide in your tank.

Hmmm....I just noticed most of the advice I'm giving you is for babies. I'm just guessing that's what you have due to the size of your tank. If you have an adult there ....some of the feeding stuff changes....but not much else. Adults diets are about 80% salad and 20% feeders. It's exactly the opposite for babies (80% feeders and 20% salad), and sometimes they don't like salad at all, but it's a good idea to get them started.

Here's a great site that tells you what's best to feed, what's not, and why: http://www.beautifuldragons.503xtreme.com/Nutrition.html
Notice that avacado and rhubarb are toxic to dragons. Also lightning bugs/fireflies are pretty much a death sentence.

Hope this helps.
 

tigerlily

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
Thank you for your advice, Bianca and Ozzysmom. As I mentioned earlier, I'll stop by the petshop and pick up some crickets on my way home and I'll be sure to ask for the pinhead size. The other worms you mention -- are those usually hard to find in pet stores? I really don't think my roommates would put up with having roaches in the house -- will the crickets be enough by themselves or should I order some worms too?

I'll probably get some reptile carpet since that would probably look the nicest. And thanks for your tips on which lights to get. There are two pet stores I frequent out here that are close to home/work but I there is a store that specializes in reptiles about 10 miles away. I'll give them a call to see if they have silk worms suitable for my baby (yes, he is a baby).

Something I find frustrating is that I see a lot of conflicting advice on the internet for these guys, as I mentioned earlier. I'll browse this site some more and see if there are some recommended books so I won't have to pester everyone with posts. And if I can figure out how, I'll post some pictures of my setup so maybe you can give me some feedback on it.

I think the MVB light sounds like a better lighting option for me right now, since the tank is quite deep, but I'll look at other possible options for basking. I saw a repti-net in one of the stores that you can attach with suction cups. Are those good for them, do they get their toenails caught in them?

I pride myself on taking excellent care of every animal I've ever owned, but this is my first reptile so I'm really nervous.
 

Ozzy's Mom

Juvie Member
tigerlily":dbac2 said:
Thank you for your advice, Bianca and Ozzysmom. As I mentioned earlier, I'll stop by the petshop and pick up some crickets on my way home and I'll be sure to ask for the pinhead size. The other worms you mention -- are those usually hard to find in pet stores? I really don't think my roommates would put up with having roaches in the house -- will the crickets be enough by themselves or should I order some worms too?

I know there are some that offer a wide variety, but a lot of people just feed crickets and salad. I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think feeding just crickets will hurt your beardie at all.

As for the roaches, I certainly understand. It would be so much cheaper, but I just can't keep tubs of roaches in my house...lol

I've never been able to find silkies or phoenix worms at any of my local stores. If you find a local reptile shop, you might be able to get them that way....otherwise you'll have to order them if you want to try them.

tigerlily":dbac2 said:
I'll probably get some reptile carpet since that would probably look the nicest.

That's what I use :wink: It's not as easy to clean as some of the other things you just wipe off, but it looks nice and I like its soft texture. I just put tiles up on Ozzy's basking platform so he can warm his belly up better. The instructions for the reptile carpet say to hand wash....I put mine in the machine and dry it (on medium) too. So far I've had it a couple months and it's still fine (though it has shrank about 1/4" or so).

tigerlily":dbac2 said:
Something I find frustrating is that I see a lot of conflicting advice on the internet for these guys, as I mentioned earlier.

Yes, you will find a lot of conflicting info. Though if you start reading lots of stuff, you'll notice most agree and there will be a few here or there that don't. In that case I stick with the majority. The biggest problem is that anyone can become an author on the web without any sort of education, experience, or endorsements. You have to look at the author's credentials before taking them too seriously.

Basically what I look for is someone that's raised several beardies successfully for several years. I figure if they were successful, their husbandry practices must be pretty good.

Just to let you know, I've only been a beardie owner since May. However, I am on here constantly....trying to learn as much about my critter as I possibly can. I am also close friends with a vet, who I can bounce questions off of........and my hubby has a lot of knowlege from his 30yrs of reptile experience before I met him. I still ask questions all the time and learn new things daily. (I never knew reptiles passed gas....I learned that yesterday...LOL)

I will never give advice unless I'm sure of my answers and have read a lot of information to back them, and can provide the sites for you to also read it. If I'm uncertain of something, I either leave it out of my post, or let you know I'm not sure about it.

tigerlily":dbac2 said:
I'll browse this site some more and see if there are some recommended books so I won't have to pester everyone with posts.

Don't ever feel like you're pestering anyone. We're all here to learn and help each other. I don't always write such long posts....and hope that the poster will look some stuff up because they don't always ask a lot of important questions.

You, however, are asking very good questions that are important to your beardie's health. As long as I'm not too tied up with the family, I'm more than happy to help out as much as possible.

tigerlily":dbac2 said:
And if I can figure out how, I'll post some pictures of my setup so maybe you can give me some feedback on it.

We all love pictures here!

First go to http://www.photobucket.com and create an account. Then upload your pics into your photobucket account.

Once you have them loaded, underneath each one will be an html address. Then:

1. While typing the body of your post on this site, click the "Img" button above.
2. Copy the html address under your photo on the photobucket site into the body of your post on this forum (right after you click Img).
3. After pasting, then click the "Img" button above again.
4. When finished with entire post click "Submit".

tigerlily":dbac2 said:
I think the MVB light sounds like a better lighting option for me right now, since the tank is quite deep, but I'll look at other possible options for basking. .

MVB is supposed to be great. It's UVB intensity is much higher than that of a normal UVB bulb, and really brings out the colors of your beardie. It also makes them more active from what I've read. The biggest drawback, and the reason I don't use one, is that they are pretty pricey. Since I haven't used them yet, I'm not sure which one is best. Though if you start a separate post....labeled "what is the best MVB to buy" you will get tons of help. Be sure to ask how long they last and if the company gives replacements for bulbs that don't last their stated hours. I know some brands have a tendency to burn out way too fast.

tigerlily":dbac2 said:
I saw a repti-net in one of the stores that you can attach with suction cups. Are those good for them, do they get their toenails caught in them?

I know a bunch of people here use them and haven't heard of any problems. I have no experience with them. I just thought it looked like something Ozzy would get his nails caught in, so I never got one. You might be able to find someone else that can answer this better.

tigerlily":dbac2 said:
I pride myself on taking excellent care of every animal I've ever owned, but this is my first reptile so I'm really nervous.

I'm sure you'll be a super beardie slave....err....mommie. Just the fact you're here shows you care a lot. Don't worry too much. Ozzy was my first reptile too. You'll learn quick. You'll also become so attached that you'll trade any one of your human children (bf, friends...if you don't have kids) for the health of your dragon....just kidding....I think :lol:

**Here's some light reading for you: http://www.beardeddragon.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=31067 It was posted on here a couple weeks back and will give you a few chuckles. You'll laugh even more if you re-read it in a few weeks....because you'll realize every one of them is true...LOL
 

tigerlily

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
Okay, I have another question -- does the basking light have to provide light or can I use a ceramic heater instead and get a UVA/UVB light to light the terrarium overall?
 

Ozzy's Mom

Juvie Member
It would make sense to me that you could use the ceramic heat emitter if you already have a UVB bulb, but I'm gonna need help on this one. It's actually something I've wondered about myself.

Help....anyone?
 

tigerlily

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
Okay, here's a pic of my baby (whom my bf dubbed "Izzard") and a picture of his enclosure.

696bd1a5.jpg

29769810.jpg


I was very scared when I got home and saw that he wasn't moving and was just sitting in the hottest spot of the tank with his eyes closed. Fortunately, he roused a little when we put some crickets in the cage. I was disappointed that he didn't leave any room for the nice collard greens I chopped up for him. I'll try giving him some fresh ones in the morning. He's so CUTE!

When we plugged in the digital thermometer, we found the basking area was 107 degrees farenheit and the "cool" area was 95 degrees. Those seemed a little high, so we removed the ghetto fix we were using (aluminum foil around some of the tank) and turned of the substrate and then temps in the cool area were around 85 degrees and the basking rock was between 95 and 99 degrees.

By the way, thanks for the tip about the gauge style thermometers - they were reading about 20 degrees LOW! I plan on investing in a thermostat before winter so we won't have to monitor the temperature so closely.
 

Ozzy's Mom

Juvie Member
Looking good!

You do need to get that basking temp back up to about 110F (not over 115F) though. All beardies, little guys especially, need those higher temps to aid them with digestion.

Sorry your Izzard didn't eat his greens after your hard work :lol: When they are little, this will probably happen often since only 20% of their diet comes from the greens. Even as an adult, Ozzy will occasionally have a day where he'd rather have crickets than his salad and he'll go on strike. Lucky for me, I'm more stubborn than he is :lol: I won't give him any crickets till he eats his salad...and he always give in. (PS...that theory isn't good for babies though....they need their bugs.)
 
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Clapton is acclimating okay I think. He's quick as lightning so I'm not sure how much I should bring him out of his house yet. He's not at all interested in his salad though. I wonder if I should change what I'm giving him. Least he's eating his crickets.

Things to do:
Buy calcium powder
Material to raise surface for basking spot
Scenery decals for back of tank

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