what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

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what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby BEARDIE144 » Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:13 pm

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i just got my BD his name is pedro. i been useing newspaper for a substrate i was just wondering wat would be a good one cuz i heard calci sand can cause impaction like regular sand wat do i do please help :cry:
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby Mobalized » Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:21 pm

calcium sand is actually more likely to cause impaction than sifted play sand because it clumps when it becomes wet. i think most users will recommend a slate or tile, or non adhesive shelf liner to use for a substrate
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby kirby » Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:40 pm

even playsand has caused multiple impactions. no particle substrate is safe, or apropriate.

go slate, tile, non adhesive shelf liner, paper towel, brown paper, repti-carpet.
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby Mobalized » Wed Oct 22, 2008 2:29 pm

Just to make sure its known i wasnt saying use play sand i was just stating that it has LESS of a chance of impaction when consumed than calcium sand. i am aware no partial substrate is recommended
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby NegativeCreep » Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:21 pm

We use paper towels, for now. We have some great tile, it just needs to be cut to fit ATM...
Newspaper is fine to use, although it's not as pretty (and neither is the paper towels)...
But, I work for a newspaper, and please don't use colored ink inside your cage! The black ink is soy based, but the colored ink has a ton of different chemicals. Red is the worse, but they are all bad. If at all possible, use blank newsprint. You can go to the front counter at your local newspaper (usually) and get an end roll of newsprint for a couple of bucks.
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby jscott » Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:27 pm

id stay away from any partical substrate; sand, woodchips, dirt, coconut fibers... the wet part of your dragons poop seeps down into the bedding. after awhile it will start to smell.

use textured tile, just lay it in the tank. when it comes time to clean, simply pull it out and scrub it with soap and hot water.

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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby BEARDIE144 » Thu Oct 23, 2008 3:26 am

thanks for the colored inc warning i have ben doing that i dint know. i dont really have tile can i use reptil
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby NegativeCreep » Thu Oct 23, 2008 5:25 am

I'm not sure what you are asking now, but check out the leftovers at a floor store or home store. There are likely to be some tiles that are on clearance since there are not enough left for anything significant. You may be able to get some pretty nice ones for $1 or so each.

Reptile carpet is also ok, just be sure your beardie is large enough so it's claws don't get caught in it.
Non-adhesive shelf liner can also be used, but I prefer to use it in the kitchen for opening jars and keeping my cutting board still :lol:
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby sparticus » Thu Oct 23, 2008 5:54 am

BEARDIE144 wrote:i just got my BD his name is pedro. i been useing newspaper for a substrate i was just wondering wat would be a good one cuz i heard calci sand can cause impaction like regular sand wat do i do please help :cry:

Hi i know this will bring a flood of comments regarding impaction but i have used calcium carbonate ever since i have kept bearded dragons, with know problems at all. Some might say this is pure luck. I however don't.

To my way of thinking b ds are a desert lizard and desert means sand and loads of it. If they live in it in their natural enviroment why should you go to B & Q and buy ceramic tiles, or self adhesive tiles? In the book General Care and Maintenance of Bearded Dragons by Philippe de Vosjoli & Robert Mailloux under Substrates it clearly says to use a fine silica sand ( no finer than #30) or a sand made up of fine decomposed granite. Or fine aquarium gravel or pebbles.

I am not saying that if you use sand your b d won't get impaction, but if you choose to use it does not say your dragon will get it. I think it's nature. I personally would sooner see my b ds running around on a substrate nearer to their natural enviroment than skiding around on B & Q tiles. Also how many of you actually know someone who has had a lizard die from it. Perhaps we should get some sort of partition up and send it to the Australian Goverment and ask them to tile all their outback deserts. I'm sure the tile suppliers would sign it.

This is however just my own views on it and at the end of the day the choice is yours. PS i now await the flack. :angry5: :banghead:
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby terabith » Thu Oct 23, 2008 6:19 am

i dunno if the sand i got is hurting my dragon or not....but i really do not recommend it as a substrate. i really regret my purchase, and i wish i had started my research before getting that new substrate. (i bought reptile calcium sand that clumps from the pet store, i didn't know better at the time, i thought that was what i had to get)

- first, it smells. not just around the tank, but my entire apartment living area has a slight sand odor.
- second, the clumping might be useful for some situations but i hate it. for example, this morning my beardie thought it would be great fun to build up a mountain of sand right next to his water dish and then dump all the water from the dish onto that sand mountain. i dunno how he did it, but it ruined a LOT of sand. (*sigh* i really need to build him some toys soon)
- third, it was really expensive. play sand is cheaper, but that crap from the pet store was just ridiculous for no gain.

so yea, that's what i think of sand substrate :cry: however, it was a quick fix to set the issue of substrate aside temporarily while i worked on more important things my viv needs. i'll be replacing it with blank newspaper or tiles as soon as everything else is done.
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby NegativeCreep » Thu Oct 23, 2008 7:48 am

sparticus wrote:PS i now await the flack. :angry5: :banghead:


Beardies live much shorter lives in the wild. Sometimes, wild conditions are best, sometimes not. A beardie in captivity, under proper conditions, can live 10x longer..
That's all my flack! :wink: :P
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby jscott » Thu Oct 23, 2008 9:08 am

sand man, you quote that book but your not even using the sand they recomend :roll: .

in the book you mention, they recomend using silica or finely decomposed granite. well heres the deal:

silica is usually found as quartz(unless your using silicon chips, that would look futuristic :lol: ). quartz has a strong chemical bond and will not disolve or reform easily. granite is usually composed of feldspar, mica and quartz. feldspar is another extra hard stone that will not disolve while mica is a relatively soft, sedementary stone.

then your talking about tiling the outback. what?! they dont live on sand dunes :roll: . they live on clay-like ground thats been baked hard by the sun. little topsoil, mostly squat shrubs and grass.

in my opinion hard, clay-like ground is more like tile than it is loose calcium sand. btw, they dont "skid around". if you use textured tiles they can rip across the enclosure like nobodys business.
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby sparticus » Thu Oct 23, 2008 9:41 am

NegativeCreep wrote:
sparticus wrote:PS i now await the flack. :angry5: :banghead:


Beardies live much shorter lives in the wild. Sometimes, wild conditions are best, sometimes not. A beardie in captivity, under proper conditions, can live 10x longer..
That's all my flack! :wink: :P

Hi i fully agree with you that a Beardie in captivity,under proper conditions can live longer. But proper conditions covers a large area. I consider myself as a responsible owner and get great pleasure from my beardies, and i would not put them at risk or hurt them in any way knowingly. All i'm saying is if i posted a picture of my viv showing i use sand and saying one of my b ds looked unwell i would be flooded with comments like you use sand he's got impaction take him to the vet. However send the same pictue and comment in showing the viv with a tiled floor it woudn't be mentioned. Impaction can be caused through a number of things,improper diet being one, and yes i will include sand but i still think it occurs in very small amount of beardies. In the wild they must constantly take in sand with their prey. I believe that if impactions occur in the viv, they possibly are due to captive-indused weaknesses in the beardie. The weakness prevents the beardie from correctly processing the food and the sand it takes in. A common feeding practise also increases the chances of impaction, feeding moist foods. Like i said every owner has his or her own way of doing what they think is best for their beardie and i just don't think if you choose to use sand as a substrate you should be classed as a bad owner. Oh and thanks for no flack :D :wink:
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby sparticus » Thu Oct 23, 2008 10:03 am

jscott wrote:sand man, you quote that book but your not even using the sand they recomend :roll: .

in the book you mention, they recomend using silica or finely decomposed granite. well heres the deal:

silica is usually found as quartz(unless your using silicon chips, that would look futuristic :lol: ). quartz has a strong chemical bond and will not disolve or reform easily. granite is usually composed of feldspar, mica and quartz. feldspar is another extra hard stone that will not disolve while mica is a relatively soft, sedementary stone.

then your talking about tiling the outback. what?! they dont live on sand dunes :roll: . they live on clay-like ground thats been baked hard by the sun. little topsoil, mostly squat shrubs and grass.

in my opinion hard, clay-like ground is more like tile than it is loose calcium sand. btw, they dont "skid around". if you use textured tiles they can rip across the enclosure like nobodys business.

So your saying that Australia is more like tiles and theres no sand and loose particals. H'mm i must have gone to the wrong continent when i was there last. You are exactly the type of person i was reffering to. :( Oh and they do skid around when you put two pairs of roller boots on them :wink: :wink: :blob8:
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Re: what sand and other substrates are great for beardies

Postby BEARDIE144 » Thu Oct 23, 2008 12:27 pm

o sorry i meant can i use repti carpet my bad
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